JEREMY HAYS – PRO BASKETBALL SKILLS TRAINER & FOUNDER OF FADEAWAY FITNESS – EPISODE 768

Website – https://www.fadeawayfit.com/

Email  – fadeawayfitnessllc@gmail.com

Twitter – @FadeawayFit

Jeremy Hays is the founder of Fadeaway Fitness, a company that specializes in skill development workouts for the game of basketball. He works with all athletes looking to improve speed and agility, strength and conditioning, balance and control, and nutrition.

Jeremy played his college basketball at Juniata College where scored over 1200 points and is the school record holder for assists and steals.  He was named to the All Landmark Conference Team in 2013 and 2014.  After college he played professionally in Italy, Mexico, Canada, and the US.

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Grab a notebook and pen as you listen to this episode with Jeremy Hays, Pro Basketball Skills Trainer and Founder of Fadeaway Fitness.

What We Discuss with Jeremy Hays

• Falling in love with and dreaming about basketball as a kid
• Learning from the old And 1 mix tapes
• “I’m a big proponent of three on three because the spacing’s better, you get more touches.”
• “If you can just have better feet, you can be a significantly better basketball player.”
• “I just want to see how you actually prepare for what you’re about to get into, meaning a workout or a game or practice.”
• Effort has to come from the player, not the parent
• Providing players with solutions to work on their weaknesses
• “I want to make you the most skilled player that you can become.”
• Excelling in your role
• “Just take care of your own life and run your own race.”
• Players should ask their coaches…how can I get better?
• “Fight through tough conversations to come out better in the long run.”
• The impact of the transfer portal
• Building Fadeaway Fitness
• His partnership with Shane Hennen
• How social media helped him grow his brand
• His “Beat the Trainer Challenges” on social media
• Running camps and events in various locations across the country
• The Three Point Open
• Appearing on Fox and Friends

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The Coaching Portfolio Guide is an instructional, membership-based website that helps you develop a personalized portfolio.  Each section of the portfolio guide provides detailed instructions on how to organize your portfolio in a professional manner.  The guide also provides sample documents for each section of your portfolio that you can copy, modify, and add to your personal portfolio.

The first Training Camp – Elite Skill Development and Performance Combine will be held on the campus of Western Reserve Academy, just outside of Cleveland, OH powered by Unleashed Potential & the Hoop Heads Podcast. The camp is designed for boys rising to grades 6-9 and will take place June 29 – July 1, 2023. An emphasis on improving your individual skills in the context of a team environment will be the hallmark of the Training Camp. 

Mike Klinzing from Head Start Basketball/The Hoop Heads Podcast & Joe Stasyszyn from Unleashed Potential will serve as the Camp Directors of this inaugural Training Camp.

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THANKS, JEREMY HAYS

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TRANSCRIPT FOR JEREMY HAYS – PRO BASKETBALL SKILLS TRAINER & FOUNDER OF FADEAWAY FITNESS – EPISODE 768

[00:00:00] Mike Klinzing: Hello and welcome to the Hoop s Podcast. It’s Mike Klinzing here with my co-host Jason Sunk tonight, and we are pleased to be joined by Jeremy Hayes from Fadeaway Fitness. Jeremy, welcome to the Hoop Heads Pod.

[00:00:10] Jeremy Hays: What’s going on guys? Hey, I definitely appreciate you guys having me on and talking a little bit about my journey and everything that I’ve kind of done to get here, but more importantly, just how we can grow the game and keep the basketball game moving forward.

[00:00:25] Mike Klinzing: We are excited to have you on looking forward to diving into all the different things that you’ve been able to do throughout the course of your basketball life. Let’s start by going back in time to when you were a kid. Tell me about how you got introduced to the game and what are

some of your earliest memories?

[00:00:38] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, for sure. Literally, I mean I’m the youngest of three, so like my dad always kind of like coached my brother and sister just as they were kind of growing up into the game. And so I was just kind of the kid that just tagged along and was always in the gym and I think I just naturally. I’m not going to say fell in love, I’m going to say became obsessed with it at an early age.

And I think I just picked up on things really easy and I was able to dribble and be able to handle the basketball with, with both hands especially at a young age. So I think that really, really helped me kind of moving forward into my playing career. But yeah, just at a young age fell in love with the game, became obsessed with it and just always enjoyed how I could get better, but also more importantly, just like how I could and improve myself to kind of become like the best version of the basketball player I could of my own, my own self.

So yeah, it’s been fun kind of watching this whole, everything grow through my basketball career. And they said if I didn’t fall in love with it at a young age, I don’t think it would’ve taken me as far as it did to this point.

[00:01:42] Mike Klinzing: When you were younger, what did that obsession look like? So let’s say fifth, sixth, seventh grade, what did being obsessed with basketball mean for you?

[00:01:49] Jeremy Hays: What did that look like? I don’t know if how many kids are going to listen to this, but probably not paying attention in class. just dreaming about basketball. Literally anywhere I went, if even if I walked to like, maybe my grandma’s house, maybe 10, 15 minutes away, just taking a basketball walk and like you’re playing one on zero against like a fire hydrant that’s coming up and like turning it into like an Iverson cross and like, I don’t know, I just kind of like it, it was, I’m not going to say it was different, and I just think that like, I don’t know, I just became obsessed with the game and just like always had a basketball in my hand.

And I enjoyed watching it and I enjoyed competing, even if I missed a shot, I enjoyed. The whole process of it all. And I think that was a big, big point for me because like I said, I know so many kids, especially the kids that I work with today, that like, man, it, it’s either as soon as somebody yells at them or gets on them, it’s like they turn around the other way.

And I was just like the complete opposite. I thrived when like, I guess there was a little bit of adversity or like, you’re playing against, I’m in fourth grade playing against college guys and they’re crushing me. But like, I don’t know, I just enjoyed kind of the process of it all. But yeah, when I was, when I was in grade school, just I think I could always handle the basketball.

I think I could finish with either hand. And I think that right then and there set me apart from kids my own age just because I technically could shoot a left hand layup with my off hand . And then I started to just be able to shoot a little bit. So like naturally being able to handle the ball, finish it with either hand, be able to shoot it, and then I think just naturally being a little bit more athletic.

That just kind of set me apart and I really started to see some success at a young age. And like now I’m like, man, I actually, I think I could really kind of get into this. And I mean I played every sport, I guess you could say growing up, but as, as I progressed in my age and, and grades in school, I just kind of like, I don’t know, got out of baseball, got out of soccer, football, that stuff, and just like, just continued to fall even more in love with the game of basketball.

And like, it’s been I mean now I’m 30 now and I still feel the same way, so I don’t think I’ll ever, I don’t think it’ll ever kind of go away from me. Did

[00:04:05] Mike Klinzing: Did you have a formal plan for getting better? When you think about what you do now in terms of training and the time that you put into preparing and making sure that you’re ready to teach kids that you’re working with how to do the things that they need to do to be successful, compared to when you were a kid, were you putting together a plan or were you more just.

I’m just kind of out working on my game and I’m playing, I’m doing this. Was it more formal or informal with you?

[00:04:28] Jeremy Hays: It was different because I feel like I’m in that like generation gap between like before smartphones and everything and the internet and like now everybody that has the internet and smartphones and like, honestly, what people always ask me is like how I kind of got into it.

There were no really no trainers. Where I’m from whatever I was growing up. But what I always tell people, and I don’t know if it’s good or bad, but I used to watch a lot of an one mixtape hot sauce professor AO, skipped my little, all those guys. And YouTube became a very popular thing at that time.

And I think it might have just been like just starting. So I literally watch am one mixtape . And like I, I don’t know how I see things. I can, and I, I see it as like a skill development guy. Now I’m like, how I break it down from their footwork to their first dribble with their timing of their step to when they pick the ball up to, so I could, like, how I how I read it is like, Hey, a drop to a dribble timing with your pickup with your stripes.

And I’m like, I’m seeing that. I don’t know, I didn’t know all the terminology then, but like, I’m seeing that as a kid and like, I literally remember I would just like write it down on a piece of paper and just like somehow take that outside to the, to the, like I had a little hoop on, on top of my garage in the street, middle of the street.

And like, I would just try that stuff and like, how could I like do it one, but then how could I like learn to counter off of it and then learn to, hey, how can I get into a shot off of this? And like, I mean, and I was a very, and I’m not saying like lonely kid, I’m not saying that at all. I was, I mean, I was always with people, but like I enjoyed working on my game by myself.

And like, I think, I think a lot of kids are missing that for one. They’re missing a lot of like the Imagination piece. And I think that’s a big piece and I don’t, I don’t even know where, how you learned that. I have no idea. But like, I had no problem being able to visualize a defender, trying to guard me, and I’m like trying to get by them and work on the same things I would see based off of the and one mixtape tour

Which is, which is, I don’t know, like I said, I don’t know if it’s good or bad, but like it got me to high school, college, some pro stuff in to now. Like, so I think it had some kind of impact on me. But yeah, I was, I would say guess a loner and I enjoyed working out by myself. And every once in a while, hey, I’d ask my dad maybe, Hey, can you come out and rebound for me?

And like, he was always a guy that always had stuff going on. So like, they come out for your five minutes and then, all right, we have to , we have to, we have to head back inside. Like, I’m like, all right, well thanks for the, thanks for the five minutes, the eight shots. There you go. Like, that’s funny.

But I mean, looking back on it, like, I don’t regret anything. And like, I wish I honestly, I mean everything now, I mean, you could say that easily, but like, I wish I would even put in more time and I mean, I was always the kid that was always at the park playing pickup. And I don’t know.

I just, like I said, I was just obsessed with the game and like, and I’m not saying my grades ever like, like diminished because of basketball, but at the same time I was like, I was very, very fortunate to put in a lot of time. And that’s the only thing that like, I truly, truly had a crazy passion for.

And like I said, it’s, it was, it is been cool. And I know, I know I read a, read a quote or whatever from Kevin Durant and like he was saying like, 80% of his time spent is by himself. And I’m like, I just don’t think kids do that enough. Whether that’s with a trainer, without a trainer, with a rebounder, with a partner, or just by yourself.

Literally by yourself. And like, I don’t think kids do that enough today, or go play pickup. Or like I said, go to the park and just organize some kind of run and get into arguments and, and not saying fights, but like being, being competitive and learn how to win. Like, I wish that more and more kids can do that.

And I don’t know if I’m part of the problem just because like any, anytime anybody wants to work out, I have my own facility now, it’s like, okay, well you’re going to come inside, like, right, yeah, I’m going to structure it all for you, like easy because that’s a business thing. But at the same time, like, man, I think that was the big turning point.

I think just for myself when I was a younger kid and I think a real big turning point. I’ll give my sister a shout out. Jessica Hayes, Jessica McNabb, now, she just got married not too long ago, but. She got her license and it became like, I guess that was that annoying little brother that always like, wanted to tag along and spot down here.

I’m from the West Virginia area. It always, always, it was always like, yo, just show up and play pickup in the summertime. So like, she would always go down just to basically hang out with all her friends. It was like a, she was like a hangout spot in the summer, but I would, I would tag along, I’d shut up in the car, I’d just not, not talk.

And then I get there and then I, I learned how to compete against guys that were my age now. So if I’m 13, 14, playing against guys that are 30, 35 and like they’re in college, they’re out of college, they’re in the workforce, they’re a lot bigger, faster, stronger than me. Like, I think that like helped prepare me for my own journey because I think I learned how to compete.

I learned how to hold my own. I learned how to like play without the ball. I learned how to. Like become a leader. How can I get a bucket and then like feed off of that momentum? I don’t know. I think that, like I said, that was big, a big turning point for me. I think just as myself so I’d be all individual by myself up until now.

All of a sudden it’s in the evening time and now I can go play, pick up and kind of string it and put it all together.

[00:10:06] Mike Klinzing: You must have stole my script, man.

[00:10:09] Jeremy Hays: Well, listen, I apologize. You want me to turn around and start asking you these questions then? No, I, well, yeah, you can ask me any questions you

[00:10:16] Mike Klinzing: No, I, well, yeah, you can ask me any questions you want, but like the things that you just said, that rant that you just went on is a rant that I’ve gone on.

People who listen to the podcast are probably sick of me going on that rant, but I always tell people that when I grew up, similar to what you just described, like I think for my development as a player, the opportunity to go and play pickup basketball outdoors against guys that were a lot older than me, all different places, all different demographics.

that’s what made me better, guys taking me under their wing and kind of showing me the little tricks of the trade and having to be competitive. And I remember being 13, 14 years old and being like, I have to be the first guy to the court so that I can get in that first game. Right? Where they’re not like, Hey, we’re not picking up this little kid.

Right? But hey, he’s our 10th guy, so let’s let him play. And then I had to stay until the end so that maybe there was one last game. Yep. That I could get in. Hey, we need one more guy. All right, we’re going to let, we’re going to let Mike get in the game. And I think that from a development standpoint, there’s just something that’s lost in the fact that kids are always playing in a gym with a coach, with mom and dad in the stands.

Against their own age group. And I just think that there’s, there’s some piece of it that lost. And I always say there’s a ton of good things about the system that we have today. Kids have way more access to gyms than I ever had. Right? Right. So again, if you can work on your game in a gym, it’s probably better than working on a asphalt court with pebbles and the rims are bent and all this other stuff.

Right. But you do learn some of the things that you talked about, how to be resilient, how to be tough, how to stand up for yourself, how to navigate just playing in a game where there isn’t a bunch of adult, well, maybe you’re playing against the adults, but there’s not somebody else in charge of what’s happening.

Nobody’s going to stand up for you if you don’t stand up for yourself. Yeah. And I think that those things are missing. And then the other thing that I thought was interesting that you hit on is talking about the creativity. And I know I did the same thing that you did. I’m out in my driveway and I’m pretending to play against guys.

In my mind, I’m playing one-on-one and you’re trying to outscore them, and you’re just imagining this defender that you’re trying to get by. And I think all those things just. It’s a different way, the way we develop players today is different. And I think you can make an argument that in some ways, and I’ve said this before too, on the pod that you go, you go back to, and again, I’m going to be 53 tomorrow, so I played a long time ago.

But I go back and I think to my era of high school, so you’re looking at late eighties, let’s say, even in through the nineties that you look at player number 12, 11, 10, 9 on a high school roster. Like those players, for the most part weren’t tremendously skilled. Every team back in that era had like the six two football kid who did nothing but set screens and rebound.

[00:12:55] Jeremy Hays: And now kids coming off the screen like, exactly,

[00:12:58] Mike Klinzing: Those kids don’t, those kids don’t exist. I mean, now you look at player number 12 on a high school roster, and if you just put them in a workout by themselves and let them demonstrate their skill, like they’re way better at handling the ball, they can shoot it.

It’s just, it’s so much better. But I do think the one thing, and I, I’m curious to hear if you. Kind of agree with this, but one of the things that I think is that the very best players, I still think that there’s, there’s an IQ piece and a competitiveness that you developed on the playground that I’m not sure that every kid develops under the system that we have today.

And again, I know I’m an old guy, I know I’m biased, but I still feel like there’s, especially for the best players, I think the system overall is, is probably better today for everybody. And it’s certainly better for girls. Right, right, right. Than it is, than, than it, than it ever was. But I still think for the top end player, there’s something to be said for going out and playing four hours of pickup basketball as opposed to being stuck in a gym playing AAU basketball summer.

Not to say that AAU basketball isn’t great cause it is, but man, there’s, there’s just something for something to be said. Being out on a hot playground for four hours is what that, what that develops in you? It sounds like you, you’ve had a similar experience.

[00:14:09] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, a hundred percent. And I, I, like, I can kind of touch on that AAU point and I’m like, I mean, I guess I’m extremely biased just because I’m a skill development guy and I’m not in the AAU scene.

But at the same time, if I’m, if I’m like, you said player number 10, 11, 12, and maybe I get in the game, so this is my thought is like, okay, if I go to an AAU tournament and let’s just say it’s Friday, Saturday, Sunday, you’re there for three days, whether you go to drive three, four hours, hotels, food, all that, that’s a lot of money.

But then also it’s like, okay, well let’s just say you play five games. You shoot five shots in each game. I mean, I’m no math whiz, but five shots, five games, 25 shots in an entire weekend. Like, how much better are you truly going to get if that’s the amount of reps you’re going to get in over a three day period?

Like go, go rent out or buy a shooting machine. I mean, I know they’re not cheap, but at the same time I’m like, and go shoot a thousand shots in an hour. And, and how can I, how can I truly develop like my skillset and then take that to the game and how I can apply that? And like, like I said, I like I, I, you just showed up at the park and you just figured it out and that, like I said, no one, no one had to set it all up.

And like I said, and I’m a bad cause of that because I have access to a gym and I structure everything how I do with, because I run a business and all that. But one thing that I did just implement into my company is literally a three on three, just like play, it’s a night thing, but like one, because I can have access to a gym.

Two, I have access to all the kids. Okay. Three, I can make a business decision and make money off of it. That. But I structure it where it’s, Hey, it’s three, I only invite 18 kids, nine on one end, nine on the other end. It’s three on, three on three, and it’s a continual rotate. And it’s like one shot, one possession only.

Next, next three on that, that three is off. And it’s just, I feel like the kids, because it’s like, it’s structured. Yeah. They understand it. But also it’s like, I’m not telling you everything what to do. And, and it’s three on three versus five on five. And like, I’m a big proponent of three on three because like the spacing’s better, you get more touches, everybody can kind of get a look versus like, yo, if you got that one guy that just is, I’m going to jacket every time, five on five.

Like, yo, I’ve been there, I’ve done that. I’ve been that guy. Like, right. It ain’t fun for everybody. So I’m like, okay, well if I can structure this, I can make money off of it. But like, at the end of the day, like the kids really will benefit from it the most. Like I’ve seen a, a pretty good response from it.

And like it’s only going to grow just as. As school lets out. So that’s kind of why, why I really wanted to touch on it now and kind of get it introduced to my clientele, get it introduced to like my community of kids and pool and like, okay, now as soon as school lets out, now I can really open it to, hey, it’s like almost like an everyday like occurrence that, hey, something’s going on in the gym and you can figure out how to get better.

But like I said, I think there’s a piece that, like I said, kids just miss. And like I said, whether it be the basketball iq, whether it be like the grittiness and the competitiveness inside of them, whether it be like just the like how skilled they truly are. And I feel like there’s several different kids, like you said, you touched on like kid number 12 could possibly be the most skilled kid that you have on the team, on the roster and like put him in a workout and he is got all the footwork.

He’s got all the finishes, he’s got all the shots, he’s got the, how do you step into a shot correctly, like he can make shots, but yet he doesn’t understand the system of how to play or the IQ of how to play or being able to put it together against a live defender. And then I think on the converse and is like you got like a pure athlete who just knows how to play, knows how to do everything, but if you put them into an individual workout, like their footwork’s terrible, like yep.

That you just, they, they’re just skilled enough to get by and be way better than everybody else because maybe they’re four inches taller, they can jump in, touch the top of the corner of the backboard, like a a And I think that, like that’s where, okay, how can I, in my mind, figure out what does this kid need to compliment their game?

And if it’s once just a simple, Hey, it’s your footwork. If you can just have better feet, you can be a significantly better basketball player and if it’s that, if it’s something else, hey, you need to literally work on just your offhand, Hey, you need to work on your basketball cue.

Go study film. Like, and that’s a big thing that like just kids don’t do. And I think, and I’m not knocking kids, I’m not knocking parents, but like, I think sometimes people turn a blind eye to the kids’. Weaknesses, oh no, my kid is, is great, my kid’s going to be the next Jordan, next LeBron. I heard it all. And like, so that’s a big thing that I like to ask is like every single time that they, somebody wants a new, a new client reaches out, wants to get in the gym, like one naturally, Hey, how did you hear of me?

How did you hear of my brand, my company? But then also like, what do you feel like as the parent, what do you feel like is the kids’ strengths and weaknesses? Because it’s always interesting to hear what they. And like, oh my kid’s really good. This is, and I’m like, yo, you came in and they can’t, kid can’t dribble like

No, no wonder the kid ain’t playing. Like, just trying to be real and like, I think that’s a hard pill to swallow sometimes because like, okay, in my mind, one, I’m trying to be as real and as truthful to these people as I can, but two, I’m also running a business. So it turns into like, okay, well I mean I’m just going to put this in realistic terms.

Your kid sucks, but like now did I just lose that client? Are they ever going to come back to me? Like, and and it’s hard to, it’s hard. It’s hard to just say something to somebody, but like I feel like if you can tell them and show them what their weaknesses are and how to improve them and how we. Put together a plan to work on them, man, the kid will be so receptive to it.

The parents will be so much more receptive to it. And like, like I said, they’ll, they’ll see that I truly care and actually truly want your child to improve. And like, that’s a big piece with me is if I can get the kid to improve a little bit in a short amount of time, then they see that, and then I’m like, okay, so now buy completely in and let’s go and let’s really crush like your skill development needs so we can put this together and you can score four more points a game or play 10 more minutes, get something.

But at the end of the day, your kids have to buy in to really what you’re doing and start to see a little bit of success off of it.

[00:20:54] Mike Klinzing: All right. Let’s talk a little bit about that. Yeah. When you’re, when you’re first meeting with a person, though, what I hear you saying, I think this is something that you mentioned in dilemma, right?

That, when you tell people the truth, sometimes they don’t want to hear the truth. And then because there are, let’s face it, a proliferation of trainers out there. If somebody tells you something that you don’t want to hear, then those people generally walk and they go find somebody who tells them something that they do want to hear.

So I think as a trainer, one of the things that’s a challenge is you have to be able to tell people the truth that, hey, your kid stinks. Or, Hey, your kid can’t trip with their left hand. Or, Hey, your kid can’t shoot, or whatever it is. And then you also have to be able to then frame it in a way of, okay, this is their weakness.

This isn’t what they’re good at, but here’s the plan for how I, or we can make those changes and how we can get them better. And so it’s, I think, sometimes a, a thin line to walk on in terms of it’s a business versus being. Completely truthful. It’s a matter of, can you say it tactfully and can you say it in such a way that you’re not driving people away and yet at the same time you’re not telling kids things that aren’t true.

Cause we’ve all been, I’m sure you’ve seen it Yep. Where coaches trainers are saying, Hey you should be, you should be this or you should be that. When clearly anybody who watches that kid play Yeah. Knows that that’s not necessarily the case. So I think you have to walk that fine line, which is a big piece of it.

So my question to you is, when you have somebody come in, so somebody reaches out to you, say, Hey Jeremy, we heard about you. We’d like to come in and work with you. Now you’re trying to evaluate that kid. What does your evaluation process look like? What do you do in terms of getting the kid on the floor, watch him play and then trying to figure out what that first conversation’s going to look like of, Hey, here’s kind of where you’re at and here’s what we would need to do if I was to bring you on as a client.

[00:22:44] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, a hundred percent. So typically how I structure things, it’s either going to be like a social media direct message or. Like an email or goes through my website. So somehow they’re going to reach out to me. Preferably,I don’t put out my cell phone number at all because like people are just going to start blowing up your phone.

So as soon as I initially get that either first email, first message, like I said, I kind of like just not saying I feel it out. I mean, I’m, yeah, I’m going to work with you, but like, I want to know more about how you heard of me. I mean, I want to know who referred you to me. I want to know, like I said, how you found me, all this stuff.

But then also I’m like, okay, like I said, in your opinion, tell me what you think your son or daughters strengths are. Tell me what their weaknesses are. One, where they go to school, how much experience they have, what au organization they play for. If they do, like, I kind of want to get a little bit of backend and then I have a general understanding from the parents’ perspective.

Of where their kid is. And I think it’s, I would say it’s like a 70 30 mix. I would say 70%. I think people actually tell me the truth, I think 30%. I think people out here pleading the fifth a little bit and just kind of like pushing that needle a little bit too much. But at the same time, I’m like, okay, well I want you to understand what you’re telling me.

And then once we get it all set, hey, your workout is, let’s just say this week, Thursday at 5:30 PM here’s the address, all that stuff. So once they have that, typically I’m already in the middle of a session, so how it works is they can come park, come inside, Hey, sit here. Once you’re ready, you can start shooting around.

And they got like 15 minutes. And like, I feel like I’m a very observant person, so like I’m in the middle of a workout, but like I can look down on the other end too, so I can see right, right off the bat before the workout even started. one, just how they’re, how they move one, how they get loosened up.

Two how they shoot. That’s a big thing for me. So if they’re going to shoot it with proper form, hold their follow through, how their guide hand looks, all that stuff. But also it’s in an uncontrolled environment on the other end of the court where like, I’m watching you, but like, I ain’t saying nothing to you.

So I just want to see how you actually like, prepare for what you’re about to get into, meaning a workout or a game or practice, whatever. So then by the time that like I finished that first workout and the next one’s that that person’s ready to come onto me, like, I’ve already kind of watched you shoot, I’ve already kind of watched you, like how you move.

So like I can kind of get a general understanding if you can handle it. All right. If you can shoot it. All right. And then I kind of go from there. So typically how I structure like my workouts I, I feel like one, you have to be able to handle the ball. Two, you have to be able to attack the basket, preferably shoot with either hand on either side of the rim when you’re finishing off of either foot as well.

But then also how you step into a shot, catch and shoot. But also how you do a  Pull up and then you get into all your, let’s just say a ball screen or game actions. And then you’re I typically do all, like, if it’s an older kid or kid that can shoot threes at the end, like, so I kind of like, I guess you could say tear it from ball handling into finishing into shooting into game actions, into while you’re getting tired, catching shoot stuff.

And I feel like I’ve had a lot of success with that, but like at the same time, right then off the bat, within the first five minutes, I’m already watching how you handle the ball. So like, if you’re struggling with your left hand, that’s already going to tell me you’re going to struggle to shoot a left hand.

Left. If you don’t, and I, I like to use the term like, if you don’t be able to, like, if you can’t distribute your weight or your weight distribution in your ball handling, like I, I I say like how Kyrie kind of plays, like how he flows, how he, he, he uses inside of his foot all the time. Like he, he uses his body throughout the dribbles.

Like if you can do that, I see how you’re already going to play. But like, if you’re just like, do stationary ball handling and you’re just stiff not moving and you’re just, your arms are moving, I’m like, okay, how they move is different. So then it turns into, okay, how can, how can they attack the basket and then how can they move off the dribble?

How can they finish? So right then off the bat, if, if somebody can’t finish with, like I said, an offhand, I’m going to stop you and I’m going to correct. and I’m going to tell them, but also I’m going to say it loud enough. So now the parent who’s watching can understand, Hey listen, I would really love for you to work on your left hand layup.

And literally all I want you to do is just take your last step, drive up with your left hand, finish it off to the corner of the square, and I want you to do that a hundred times a day. Because I think that would really improve your offhand. So like I’m saying it in a way that like, yo, you really need to work on your offhand, but also I’m providing a, a a, a, a solution to how they can do it.

And, and it’s at home. Don’t do it when you’re with me. We can do a hundred things when you’re with me. You can only do so much when you’re by yourself if you, especially if you don’t truly understand how to get better. So I think that’s a big piece where I’m physically showing them the kid, the athlete, and the parent, like a flaw already.

But I provided a solution. So like I said, how I, not saying I’m not, I’m never going to say your kid sucks, I’m never going to say that, but in my mind I’m like, okay, if you, if you. aren’t phenomenal at one thing. How can we make you a little bit better at that? And I’m going to provide you with a solution. So I say it and I demonstrate it a certain way, but I feel like it’s in a way that like, oh, opens the p the eyes of the parents, like, oh, my son or daughter does need to work on this.

You know what they could do 10 minutes of ball handling a day. That’s not a problem. We could do that at home. So as we progress, we get into the same thing with shooting and then the footwork, and then how you finish your shot. Hey, you know what I don’t really like how you finish your follow through.

Like, maybe you should try this one hand or two hand form shooting. And now you can work on how the ball comes off your fingers and how the releases into the follow through, how it’s snapping down. Like I think that like being able to have a corrective eye and see what the kid maybe lacks or isn’t phenomenal.

like I said, provide that little solution to how they can improve, I think has been really big. So like I said, I’ll finish out the rest of the workout. All that will be phenomenal. And then now if it’s, especially if it’s my first, first time, first interaction really with that client as I talk to the parent and the child, I kind of just go through like, Hey, what did we work on today?

And like, I let them answer. I don’t want the parents to listen. I don’t want, I don’t want to tell them. I want to see what the kid actually comprehended and like, let them tell me. And I’m like, okay, that’s phenomenal. What it, what do you think you need to get better at? You tell me. So then now I can really see where the kid is at because I put you through the entire workout.

I showed you what you struggled with, I showed you and provided examples of how you can improve upon at home. Do it outside of me. So then, If the kid is understanding and know they can’t finish with their left hand, like, man, you know what, I, I really struggle with my left hand on that part, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And I’m like, okay, that, that shows that they have a little bit of a weakness. But also it showed to the parents how, how hard I’m trying to work in trying to provide, like I said, a solution to their answer. So then I always, I always gets to that point where like, okay, well out of, typically if it’s just one parent that comes, I’m like, out of us three people who are standing here who wants to get better here.

And it’s always the same answer every time. The kids always raise their hand, I do, I want to get better. That’s why I’m here. I’m like, okay, great. That’s phenomenal. But like, who wants you to get good? So myself and the parent want you to be, to be really good. They want you to get better. They want you to push the needle moving forward and actually work on your game.

But like the kicker comes into, okay, well, like how can you hold yourself accountable and how can you get better with yourself? Because like, we want you to get good. But I’m not calling you every day and say, Hey, little Johnny, did you work on your left hand ball handling? Like, mom or dad shouldn’t have to ask you to do it because then that’s them wanting it more than you.

So I feel like as soon as it gets to that point of the conversation, it’s always on the first work. And I pretty much always say it if the kid, especially if the kid struggles with a couple things, because then it, like, it opens the eyes to the kid of like, oh, you know what, if I really want this, I have to put the time and effort into it.

It can’t always come from mom or dad and it can’t always come from trainer. It can’t always come from coach. It can’t always come like from an external source. So, so as soon as I kind of asked that and structure Dad is like, okay, well if you really want to get good buddy, you have to put the time in . And I just, and I just provided you with three or four things you can do.

So I always say, listen, if you, if you come the next time and I feel like you didn’t get better on X, Y, and z, This is our last workout. This is the last time I’m ever going to sp see you. No. Am I stretching the truth with that? Maybe. But at the same time, I think the kids understand really what I’m talking about.

Like, Hey, this isn’t just a show up and let’s have fun. This, we can have as much fun as you want, but you’re here to get better. You’re here for a specific reason. And I think when I, when I kind of go through that whole spiel, I think the parents kind of see that like, oh, this, this person really does want what’s best for my kid.

Really does want to see my, my son or daughter get better. And I think I think I gained, I gained a lot of respect, I think just from the parents just from how I interact with the kids and how I actually push them and motivate them. But I’m also like, I’m never going to judge. I don’t care if you make, I literally don’t care if you make a single shot in an entire workout.

If you do everything I ask you and do it hard and try to apply it, yo, that’s perfect. That’s all I care about. Because that’s what you’re there to do is try to learn and get better. , I’m not there to, oh, you missed four free throws in a row, get on the baseline and run. No, I don’t. No, I don’t want that. But at the same time, I’m like, you’re here to get better.

So I want it to be like a judgment free environment. And I think that it’s, it’s come across that way. Or else I don’t think I’d be in the position that I’m in now.

[00:32:54] Mike Klinzing: Yeah, absolutely. I think you hit on a really good point that especially when you talk about players who are coming to work with a trainer, especially when you get down to the younger ages, right?

There’s not oftentimes a fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh grader who is actively seeking out, Hey, I want to go and work with a trainer. There are some, but most of the time that’s parent driven. And I think you hit on a really key point, and I know I experienced this with my own kids, that there comes a certain point where you try to encourage them and you’re the parent.

You’re like, Hey, you should probably pick up your ball and do some ball handling tonight after dinner. Or, Hey, are we going to go to the gym? Or whatever it might be. And at some point it either flips. or it doesn’t, and when it flips and it becomes driven by the kid, now you’re in suddenly a whole different position because the kid is now invested in it and they’re taking the time, like you said, in between workouts with you now when that kid’s getting in the gym and working on their game and working on the things that you showed them.

And they start to understand what they have to do in order to, to be the type of player that they want to be. And it becomes the kid’s journey, the kid’s mission, and no longer just the parent’s mission. I think that’s really where you have something. And obviously I, I’m guessing, and I know I was when I, back when I was doing more training, like those are the kids that you love to work with, is the kid that shows up because they want to be there not because mom or dad.

And that’s not to say that the kids don’t work hard, but you know what I mean? There’s a difference between the kid who’s there because, hey, I’m motivated to get better for me as opposed to me and dad want us to get better.

[00:34:28] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think that’s , it’s always tough to kind of like, I guess you could say, figure out who really wants it and who enjoys playing for sure.

And I mean, there is absolutely to anybody listening to this, like there is nothing wrong if you just enjoy playing the game of basketball and you enjoy being out there with your friends and you enjoy competing and you want to win and this, but it’s not like do or die. But like, and I enjoy, I a hundred percent enjoy working with those kids, but then I have the kids that just like, oh my God, I love it.

Gimme more . And I’m like, yeah, a hundred percent. Let’s go. So now you can kind of like throw the book at kids and like, and I would imagine this might be one question that you probably will ask at some point, but how I structure a lot of my, I would say youth workouts into my more experienced workouts into like your pro workouts and stuff.

And like, I feel like as kids like. Man, let them become the best skill, like the most skilled that they can become. Like, I’m not trying to put you in a box. Just because you’re five 10 at the, the in third grade or fourth grade doesn’t mean you have to go play on the block. You can handle the basketball and if you can pass well and move well, why can’t you be able to take somebody off the dribble and iceo once and get to the rim, but then take them down into the block and, and make a, a, a post move and be able to finish with either hand.

Like I feel like, because let’s just say what if that kid just caps out at five 10 is now five 10 is a sophomore. Like now all they know is to be a post. And I’m like, you’re five 10 and you’re a sophomore and if you’re probably not going to grow anymore. I don’t know how many. Five 10. And you can be honest too.

How many five, 10 centers are there in college? ? Not many. Yeah, exactly. Not many. Not many. Maybe it D Juco division six, like something, but like, yeah, so that’s where I, my, I feel like my job and, and my pH I guess you could say, one of my philosophies is like, I want to make you the most skilled player that you can become.

And that’s where I think the kids really enjoy it because like, I’m not trying to put you in a box, and I want you to, I want you to thrive in any situation that you’re in because like, if I can only catch and shoot threes, I’m only playing in situations that require me to, or our team to make and shoot, catch and shoot threes, which is, which is fine, but if I can catch and shoot threes and I can attack somebody and get by someone and create for somebody else or myself and play defense, like now, I just became so much more.

To, to the team. I can then play more minutes. But now as, like I said, as the roles start getting refined, okay, now I’m not in eighth grade anymore. Now let’s just say I’m really good. I’m starting to play varsity as a freshman, okay? I’m probably not going to play. I mean, there’s your select for you that may play significant minutes as a freshman, but like at the same time, you’re going to have a role.

You have to make the most out of your opportunities within that role, okay? Then as you continue to grow you, your role might change and adapt and you have to be able to pivot your skillset, but at the same time, you have to be flexible and willing to do that. So that’s where, that’s where I go back to.

I want you to become at an early age, the most skilled that you can become. I don’t want to try to do that when you’re a junior in high school. Now you’re trying to figure it out and go play in college and you got a year and some change left, versus you’re a fifth grader and you’re still young. But then, like I said, as you start to really, really grow and you get into college, and now it’s more of a quote unquote business like, and it’s oriented is, Hey, if you don’t thrive in what you’re doing, you’re either one, you’re going to get bench two, you’re going to lose your job to somebody else, or two or three.

You could basically lose your scholarship and just go home. We don’t want you anymore. So it gets more and more, I’m going to say stressful, I think as you grow, but like, I think it’s, it’s ultimately defined at an early age. And if kids can buy into it and enjoy the process of getting better and nothing’s ever going to be perfect or gravy, but like enjoy, enjoy the failures and, and trying to overcome and face some adversity.

But as you start to get older and like, okay, you’ve been in those situations, now you can thrive in them. Okay. Now you, let’s just say you made it to the nba. How can you figure out how to play? Okay. I’m Patrick Beverly. I’m going to be the best on ball defender that I can. Said, I don’t care if you scored 38 points a game in high school.

I want you to make millions off of playing defense. And I feel like that’s more and more of specifically a business. But at the same time, like Patrick Beverly, like you said, scored 38 points a game in high school. So like, that’s two completely different things. But he bought into his role as he got older.

Like I said, I think kids, like I said, become the best that you can, that you personally can be, but like also just enjoy having fun and getting better. And, and I mean, I mean, and you know, there’s so many pressures like Yep. For kids. Like, and, and okay, I’m a trainer. And like you said, I feel like in today’s day and age, everybody’s a trainer now.

Like everybody’s trying to tell you exactly what to do and who, what do you listen to? How do you, like, who do you listen to? Like that’s, that’s, I don’t know. I just feel like there’s so much negative BS that kids have to go through. And there’s so many outside pressures that like, I don’t know, it’s just, it’s tough.

[00:40:11] Mike Klinzing: The comparisons on social media, right? Just, oh my, you hear about this kid posting this highlight and this person that for sure got this offer. And there, and I think about going through that and when you were coming up, same thing. It wasn’t nearly as prevalent as it is today. And for me, it didn’t even exist.

And so you think about what that does to kids where they’re seeing all the time, people posting, and it is just like regular social media where people are posting the best moments of their lives, right? And you’re sitting there going, man, my life’s pretty boring compared to all this stuff I see people doing wherever.

Right. And I think kids experience that same thing when it comes to sports and when it comes to basketball specifically. It’s just, it’s crazy.

[00:40:52] Jeremy Hays: A hundred percent. And it’s just, yeah, it’s a, it’s a social media driven world right now. And like, and I, and I feel for some of the kids who are in that limelight that are like, I’m Mikey Williams, who’s been a sensation since he is, let’s just say 13, 12, whatever.

But like he’s got millions of followers, people who are trying to pull him and steer him in all different directions. Now he can make money off of n I L stuff. Right now it’s like, who do you listen to on the business side of things? How do you handle your money? Like, but then you’re like, okay, and I don’t know, whatever.

Mikey Williams is a 17 year old kid. Like if I was 17, now am I comparing myself and my life to Mikey Williams who’s flying on Puma jets, like ? That’s different. And like that’s just what’s so crazy. I think social media is a absolute blessing, but it can be an absolute curse too. And just like, I don’t know, don’t always compare yourself to people like run your own race, find your own niche, your own journey, and make the most out of your own life.

And I think that’s the best thing because like. Whatever you find that is wrong with yourself, somebody might be looking at you and just be like, damn, they kind of all figured out . And like, and it could, and you could have no idea like what somebody else is going through, but like somebody could be having the absolute worst day ever, but then they’re going to post something on social media just to get some attention or something.

And like, and I use social media, it’s, and, and it’s been great for my brand and my company, but I’m like, man, it’s just, I feel like it’s becoming harder and harder to find low key. Like what’s real, and especially as it gets into the sports scene is like, like you said, everybody’s posting their highlight tape, which is all their best clips, all their best parts of their life, all their best, everything.

But they’re never, I mean, I don’t know why you would really ever post your, your low clips, but of like, oh, here’s me missing, yeah, here’s me missing 12 shots today. But like, I, I, I, it’s just, it’s tough. And I think that’s where. The comparison stuff comes in and like, I don’t know, you can genuinely be happy and support people, but like, I feel like you have to just take care of your own life and, and I said run your own race.

And that’s a big piece and I think kids said, I would love for kids to get off social media , which is, yeah, which is great. I don’t know if I should say that because that’s majority of probably kids follow me on Instagram and TikTok and all that. But, but at the same time I’m just like, man, get out, go experience life and just like have fun.

You don’t have to sit in a room and just be scrolling all day.

[00:43:31] Mike Klinzing: You have to understand to some degree, and you have to have guidance, right? I mean, if you’re a 12 or 13 year old kid, you don’t have any guidance for how to use it, whether that’s from a parent or a coach or whatever it might be. You can see very easily how it becomes addictive and how it can have serious negative impacts.

I mean, even as an adult, there’s times where you’re sitting there on your phone and you’re. looking at something and all of a sudden you’re looking at something else and all of a sudden 30 minutes have gone by and it’s super easy, right, to do that. And that’s, as an adult who knows kind of the dangers of what it is that you’re doing, you still sometimes find yourself doing that.

And so it’s just, yeah, it’s a tremendous positive in terms of the things that you can have access to compared to what you might have been able to get access to 15 or 20 years ago from a basketball standpoint. But at the same point, it’s overwhelming. And how do you know what the truth is and what the truth isn’t?

And there’s just, there’s a whole lot of different things that kids need help trying to figure out how to navigate it. And that’s, I think, a role that coaches and certainly parents can play in helping their kids being able to do that. I want to go back to something that you said that I think is super interesting, and I think it’s something that when you talk.

Training. And when you just think about player development, it’s always something that, I’m not sure, I always thought about it this way. The first person that that really I think grabbed my attention with it was Mike Procopio, who used to work for the Mavericks, and now he does, he worked with Kobe and he said that you, when you look at the highest levels of the game, so you get to the NBA and you have maybe one guy per team, and probably really less than that because not every team has one of those guys, but guys that just have the opportunity to do whatever they want, they have the ball in their hands all the time.

They can shoot it, they can dribble it, they can pass it, they can rebound. They, they’re the straw that stirs the drink and he’s like, and then there’s 415 other guys in the league who just have a role that they have to be good at one or two things, and they have to excel. At whatever those one or two things are.

And that’s kind of what you were talking about a little bit. Yeah, and I think it’s kind of interesting when you talk about player development, you think about, okay, here’s a fifth grade kid. When you work with a fifth grade kid, what you’re trying to do is you’re trying to develop that kid’s all around skillset, right?

You want them to become a better player. You want him to become a better ball handler, you wanted to become a better shooter, you want them become a better defender. You want them to have better hands, you want them to be quicker, all these different things. You want to be able to incorporate all that because you don’t know what they’re going to be yet.

And yet at the same time, it’s almost counterintuitive. Like you start getting into a high school player and certainly even more a college player and then you get to a pro guy, it’s like, okay, what are the things that you have to do on your team? Yeah. To a earn minutes or in the pros to a to get a contract and then to be able to stay on the floor and it starts to shrink down.

The things you have to be really, really good at if you’re a role player in the nba, like I don’t need to know how to run 25 picking roles per game, you know? Right, right. I need to be able to spot up and make an open three and I have to be able to guard multiple positions. If I can do that, I can make a lot of money in the nba.

I don’t have to be able to do all the things that LeBron does. And so it’s just interesting. It’s almost counterintuitive when you think about it.

[00:46:52] Jeremy Hays: Yeah. And I think that it, yeah, you touched on it a hundred percent and like, like you said, having the freedom, like if I’m Jason Tatum from the Celtics, I feel like just gimme the ball.

Everybody get out of the way. Let me kind of just do my thing. But then think if I’m like PJ Tucker, I get paid X amount of millions of dollars to basically play defense for sure. But like standstill catch and shoot corner threes, and I’m like, if, if I shoot 37% this year and then in the off season you’re going to pay me an extra $6 million if I can get my percent up to like, 40, 41%, 42%.

Like that’s what I need to figure out. How can I raise my client’s shooting percentage up four or 5%. Right, exactly. They make so they can make 6 million more. Like, I think that’s, that’s pretty crazy in my mind. And I think that like, and, and I’ll be honest, I think that’s a one area where I think trainers start to get a bad rap because it’s like, especially social media and Instagram is like, everybody just calls them Instagram trainers.

So. What’s everybody going to do? Oh, we’re going to do a hundred iso moves into a punch drag under drag into a hesi, into a misdirection into this and this. And I’m like, what are ? What are we doing? What are we doing? Who’s doing that in the game? There’s one person probably in the league right now that’s doing that, and that’s Kyrie and there’s only one Kyrie in the world.

So  I feel like exactly, we have to break down really what we’re looking to do. And go back to what I said earlier, like, I want to make kids the most skilled that they can be. I a hundred percent do. And I feel like you can throw a move or two here and there, but also don’t forget, it’s have to flow within some kind of an offense flow within some kind of defender coming at you and guarding you.

And like, so yeah, you can do a, a combo move here and there, but I feel like it’s have to be, like I said, within some kind of an understanding to the game. And I think that’s where I think a lot of trainers get a bad rap. Because I still think, I still think basketball training is relatively a new, newer industry.

And like, I mean, we’re figuring out different avenues and paths and everything. And like, like Phil Handy’s been around for forever and Ganon Baker and like, they kind of paved the way, I mean, years and years ago. But I still think that like how training the terminology takes place and how the footwork and how we can label and break down everything.

I think that’s becoming more and more like aware in today’s game. I think that’s big, but like, like, like we’re saying, how, how can I improve my high school player or college player? Or if you’re able to work with a pro player, how can I help them better themselves in their role? And in doing so, return, can I have more minutes for my kid?

How can I make my help my pro make more money? And typically I’ve been very fortunate enough to work with a lot of, a lot of college kids, a lot of girls, a lot of guys, and every and, and when it gets to about this point, so as seasons are ending as, as kids are coming home for breaks especially once it gets closer to maybe May as like, Hey, they’re coming home for the summer.

I’m always a big, hey, I mean, yeah, I’ll talk to your coach if you would like me to, but I’m always like, go into your coach’s office, please. Just ask them, Hey, what are like the three to five things that I could really work on in this off season that would either put me in a better position to score more points or can how, what three things could I do to earn more minutes in, in this?

And I’m like, now one, you were honest and upfront with your coach. Your coach is honest and upfront with you and showed ownership. To wanting to get better. I don’t care if it came from me or not. Like you’re the one having the conversation with your coach. But it gets to the point where like, now I have a little bit of a blueprint of like what we can do to improve those things.

And now when you go back to school, so I’ll use one of my really good clients, his name’s, I Isaiah Warfield, he plays at Liberty University right now. And like he came, he went into Liberty and he was playing behind like conference player of the year. And now this another guy he’s playing behind is like a two time first team all conference school record breaker, all this stuff.

And like, but he went in, he bought into the system. He wasn’t getting a ton of minutes as a freshman at all, but like talked to his coach, Hey, we want you to be able to shoot the three a little bit better and one and two drill pullups and maybe like a floater. What do you think we did all summer? Is, is now you’re coming to the gym and I don’t care if you’re here for an hour, you’re here for three hours.

We’re going to be in quote unquote, like hashtag like boring work. But like, we’re going to figure out how you can get a couple more minutes here and there next season. So then he goes back as a sophomore and he, now he’s playing like, I don’t know, nine, 10 minutes a game, whatever it is. But he worked on those things now due to graduation, transfers, all this stuff.

Hey, I literally say, Hey, go talk to your coach. Have the same kind of meeting. How can you get better? What do you need to really work on? And so he came back the next year and now he’s playing 20, 25 minutes a game. And like he bought into the system. He wasn’t playing a whole lot. And like he, he understands he’s have to get better or have to understand the, the, the team development first, but also at the same time he can get better like as an individual.

And like with that, he didn’t just pack up and hit the transfer portal because he wasn’t playing right. Loves his situation. Loves where he is at the school. Loves the coach and he was getting a couple minutes, but like now he’s, he’s a sixth man. Like now he, he, he is going to be in such a better position moving into his next year.

So I’m like, I’m super excited to get him back and like how we, how can I help you like maximize your time because now I’m seeing you come in and struggle because you know, when you’re in your, a lot of those division one kids, when they come out of high school, let’s just say they’re a McDonald’s all-American nominee and they’ve scored 1500 points and they’re always first team Allstate and all this stuff, and now you’re sitting, right.

Sometimes that’s a very tough pill to swallow for people. And especially after Covid hit, it’s like, well, as soon as one small thing doesn’t go your way, like the n NCAA gave you a way out, okay great, hit the transfer portal and you get one free, one free transfer now, like, or go figure it out and face that adversity and come out better and stronger on the other end.

And not to say you proved people wrong. You basically proved yourself, right? This is why I came here. This is why I belong here. And like, I think that’s a big thing. And I’m so, I’m so happy and proud of Isaiah because like he struggled and he, he fought that adversity and now he is figuring it out and he is seeing some return on, on that end and like, but at the end of the day, like he’s have to be able to catch and shoot, make shots.

He’s an athletic six four kid. Get to the rim one and two dribbles, get by somebody, but then use your length and defend. So now there’s three things now he can really focus and lock in on. So how can I get better? So now it’s the same as soon as there are conference tournament and NCAA tournament, all that stuff’s over with, bro.

Go talk to your coach. What do you need to do? Now? Let’s come in, let’s work on those couple things. Now that’s a specific instance versus like, Hey, I got a sixth grader who can handle it Well, who can kind of get to the basket? We need to work on creating separation work on your shot. Yeah, I have more flexibility and freedom to kind of like play around with those workouts.

But also on the other end of the spectrum, you got those kids that are either making money or playing overseas, playing in the G League or these college kids that are fighting for playing time. Like that’s a real job. Yeah. And like they have to truly buy in and like if you don’t get better at it, okay, we’ll go sit until you figure it out.

And I think that’s a, I think that’s a very tough pill to swallow, especially for college kids. Because like the coaches, coaches POed at me and upset with me and yelling at me and screaming at me in practice. But yet I really don’t know why. And like now I just have to figure it out on my own.

[00:55:11] Mike Klinzing: Well there’s two things Jeremy.  There’s two things, right that jump out at me from what you said is one, let’s take it from the player perspective. Yep. So players have to be. , I don’t know if the word is confident enough, they have to be secure enough that they can go in and they can ask that question. Yeah. Of their coaching staff.

Because so often I think players are afraid to hear from somebody else what their weaknesses are or what they’re not good at or what they need to work on. So I think that’s the first piece. And then the second part of it is if you’re a coach out there or you’re a trainer and a kid comes to you and says, Hey, what do I need to work on?

Right. If you’re that coach, you have to then be prepared and you should know, hopefully if it’s a kid that plays on your team or if it’s a kid that you’ve trained or whatever, you should have a pretty good feel for what that kid can and cannot do. And then you have to be willing to tell that kid the truth about what it is that they need to work on.

It can’t be, oh man, you’re doing great. Keep it up . You know what I mean? Like that can’t, that can’t be the conversation. It has to be, look, This kid came to me and is looking for something and now I’ve have to give them some specific things that I want to see them improve on. I think it has to be both ways.

And I think there’s some hesitation on both sides sometimes to have that honest conversation.

[00:56:35] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, no, a hundred percent. And I think that it gets to the point where like, and I, and I try to be as, like I said earlier, like honest and truthful and I respect the hell out of all the kids that I work with. If you meet me halfway and like, I want you to learn a little bit of ownership and accountability and fight for things.

If you truly want to get better, figure out how to get better. Okay. And if it’s having, maybe it’s a tough conversation with your coach. Go have that conversation. And if you’re not, and I’m just going to, and I don’t know if this is a specific term I can use in today’s day and age, but if you have to man up a little bit, like do that, like, and I feel like that that helps kids.

And you can earn some respect from your coach just because like you truly want to get better and you actually want to succeed. But like, if you don’t ever go talk to your coach and you feel like, oh, well coach is screwing me, this, and like, you ain’t ever going to improve. Like, you’re just giving yourself an out or an alibi of like, how, how, like, why I’m not playing?

So that basically just gave your coach more of a reason not to play . So like if I, if I’m that kid and like I was that kid at one point, like, Hey, what do, what do you want me to work on this off season? Luckily, like I said, I played, I mean, high school, I did some, I played in college at a very successful career and did really well.

But like as a freshman, yeah, I played 30 minutes a game, whatever, but I still wanted to get better. So like, and who knows your game and who’s going to play you more than your coach? So like, okay, go talk to them. And like I said, it’s not always roses. But like, neither is the real world . Right, exactly. So, so like, I think that’s been, I think that’s been my like, biggest driving point is like, what are you going to do when you try to go to a job later in life and there is, let’s just say a hundred applicants and they’re only choosing one and you don’t get it.

Are you going to go beg and cry to the ceo? Or like, do you have to figure it out, pivot and, and make the most out of the situation you’re in. And I feel like that’s the same point you’re in with athletics. Okay. If you’re not playing, go talk to your coach or whoever it is. And like, instead of just always casting blame and like, because you, half the time kids don’t even understand where their coaches are coming from just because they are so upset they won’t go talk and they just assume that the coach hates you or they assume that something’s magically wrong.

I don’t know. But like, Yeah, you have to get to the point where it, you have to, you have to fight through some tough conversations to possibly come out better in the long run.

[00:59:14] Mike Klinzing: And I think you also have to look at the situation and try to figure it out on your team. And I go back to when I was a college player, I came out of high school and obviously I was a really good player and I get to high school, I would get to college in my freshman year.

I played maybe, I don’t know, five minutes a game maybe. You know, and I looked around and I was a kid in high school who was the scorer, you know? I mean, I might have played defense once in a while, but I didn’t that was not, that was not where my focus was. Right, right, right. And you know, I get there as a freshman and I don’t play as much as I would’ve liked to.

And I looked at our team and who was coming back the next year, and I looked at my coaching staff. I don’t even know if I ever even had a conversation or if it was more just, I kind of looked and said, well, what are my coaches? Who do they play? Like what kind of players do they like? And I kind of tried to figure out, okay, well next year, what do we have?

Coming back? I’m like, man, we got a lot of scoring coming back, but there’s going to be an open spot here. Maybe if I can become a defender, yeah, maybe that’s going to get me playing Tom. And so I kind of just shifted my mentality of like being a great scorer in high school wasn’t going to translate to me being a 20 point scorer in college, but Right.

If I could go ahead and I could be a good offensive player, but be the best defender on the team now suddenly I could figure it out. I think so many kids, you talked about it with the transfer portal, which has made it even easier, but so many times kids get to a place or whatever and they, it doesn’t work out immediately and they kind of throw in the towel and they go somewhere else and they just don’t work through it, or they don’t look and try to analyze the situation.

And I just think that. , you make some really good points about, sometimes you just have to have those kind of difficult conversations. You have to figure it out. You have to talk to your coaching staff, you have to look at the situation, and then you have to go back to work and really work it out and, and make sure that you give yourself the best opportunity to be successful.

And that’s not to say that kids don’t, sometimes coming out of high school, thinking about just on the college level, that they don’t make the wrong decision sometimes when they come out of high school. And you know, obviously there’s good reasons for people to transfer, but when you look at the number of guys in the transfer portal and girls in the transfer portal, I mean, it’s, I mean, it’s insane.

You can’t tell me that every single one of those people made a bad mistake, made a bad decision coming out of high school. I mean, it’s like that. We better look at our decision making process and maybe reevaluate the whole thing.

[01:01:36] Jeremy Hays: Hundred percent. It’s interesting. Yeah, and I think that it, I would love, it’s on one of my phones and I, I saved it not too long ago, but there was a tweet not too long ago and it broke it down per class of, hey, there’s x amount of freshmen that went into the transfer portal and there’s X amount of freshmen that are still in the transfer portal, meaning they haven’t found a home and like it went through freshman, sophomore, junior, senior, red shirt, senior, all this stuff. And it had all the numbers. And like numbers don’t lie.

So like it gets to the point where like, man, who are advising these kids, if you’re not in a good situation, but yet you’re on a team and you could still be playing, why go put yourself in the transfer portal now. You already had that discussion with your coach and your athletic director. Now you’re in the portal.

Let’s just say you don’t find a home because no one else really wants you. Or they want to just recruit their own kids still. And then they want to get somebody who’s older and then, okay, now you, let’s just say you stay with the same team you’re currently already on. How does that look in your coach’s mind?

They’re like, exactly why should I, why should I trust you or play you? In my system and everything with, you just want to pack up and leave. Like, I think that’s tough and I’m not, I don’t know. I’m very, I don’t know, I just want to see how things move and shake moving forward. Especially with the transfer portal and there’s so many kids in there and like, I don’t know what the official numbers are, but it is staggering.

[01:03:08] Mike Klinzing: Yeah. It’s way higher in terms of the kids that couldn’t find a home. It’s way higher than anybody thinks.

[01:03:12] Jeremy Hays: So but I mean, but like I said, at the same time, if you’re in a situation where, let’s just say you had a, a couple coaching changes or something, something wasn’t jiving and you’re not in a phenomenal situation and you have a, have a chance to better your situation or better your life.

It’s your life. Like go for it. But you run that risk of like, like I said, what happens if I don’t find a home? What happens if I go somewhere else and I still don’t like it? Like what happens if I go somewhere and I don’t play? Then like, I mean there’s so many question marks, but that’s, that’s, and I’m not going to say it’s the beauty, but it’s the, the beauty in college basketball, it’s like you never know what’s going to happen until you’re there.

Coaches can damn near say whatever they want to get to say to get you there, but like right as soon as you’re there, like their main focus one is the team, but their also main focus is winning. Because if they don’t win now that they’re out of job now. So it’s like they have to provide for their family, they have to do what’s best for themselves and their family like, so, I don’t know.

I think it’s a fine line. And then you throw in, especially at more of the upper levels, but like the NIL stuff and I’m like, man, so who really runs recruiting? Do the coaches run recruiting or do maybe like these boosters who are paying these n i l run recruiting? Hey, I’ll give that kid $750,000 if you get them here.

but now what happens if the coach doesn’t play that kid? Does the booster pull the funding to the program? Does the kid up in transfer? Like there’s, ah, man, it’s just,

[01:04:52] Mike Klinzing: There’s a lot of stuff that’s going to shake out over the next five years in terms of figuring out what it’s going to look like.

And both with the portal and with NIL, it’ll be very interesting to see how the college basketball landscape, what it looks like. Oh, definitely. Five, six years from now. I mean, it’s already so different from, it is what it was 15 or 20 years ago. And then you go back even further to kind of the heyday of college basketball and kind of to where we are now, it’s just a different, it’s a different world.

And then you take the whole, like, we started off the conversation with the whole eSports AAU complex and Right. How that feeds into the whole thing. And it’s just, it’s amazing. I want to go back in time Yeah. And give you a chance to tell us the origin story of how you got started with Fadeaway. So go back to, you’re thinking about getting into the training business, just how you got started and then how you built the business itself.

[01:05:39] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, a hundred percent. Well, I always, I think naturally just kind of trained I take that back to when I was like in high school, just like a couple, like younger kids that I think just kind of like followed in my same journey that were six, seven years younger than me. But like when I would be at a park or I would be at a wellness center, even just in my driveway or something, like, they would just like, yo come work out with me and like we’re all working out together.

Like, oh yeah, I’m a little bit older, a little bit better, but like now I can kind of like help critique you along the way. So basically like, I’m not a trainer, but like I’m just helping you as I get better as I do my workout type a deal. But then as it got into college, kind of the same thing I ended up bouncing around.

I was in Mexico, I was in Canada. I did some stuff in Italy with Team USA my, after my junior year of college. And then I finished, I was in CU dad Juarez, like I said, down in Mexico. And I kind of like. Was moving on. And I got a position in Pittsburgh at a sports complex, and that was the point where I was kind of like waiting for a basketball opportunity of like, what’s next type of deal.

But like, I don’t know, I was kind of like fizzling out as a player and not that I wasn’t enjoying that a hundred percent was, but I’m like, man, I’m like, I got a pretty decent thing going now at this sports complex and I was just kind of getting out of basketball. So I started to get into almost like the fitness side of things, like sports performance training.

And I started doing, I started teaching some classes, then I ended up getting into CrossFit pretty heavy. But a guy who I grew up with, like his kids were a little bit younger than me, but this guy was a big business guy. He started a, an AAU program in Pittsburgh and I was living in Pittsburgh at the time.

Basically started this AAU program for his kids and. Like I said, I knew the kids from, from West Virginia where I grew up and everything, and so I jumped on board with this AU program as literally like, I’m the fourth and fifth grade , like boys coach. Like, I’m nothing big, like nothing. I literally, this is a very, very, very, very part-time thing.

But that, and I’m, like I said, I think that kind of got me back into the game without like, all the pressures and, and like I never really had, I guess a bunch of pressure playing, but like, I just never, I don’t know, I just enjoyed being around the game now versus like always having to go score 20 or, or like, or go perform at this part something.

So then I started going on this AU program and very quickly, and that was probably, I don’t know, 23, 24 at the time. And I was already, I think still pretty skilled and could handle the ball, but I think I speak well. I think I associate myself with people really well and personable. And then that led into, now within probably like the first month of me being this, or like, yeah, your organization.

I became the entire director of skill development. So that led into, we would do like a, you would have your team practices on specific days, whatever, but every Wednesday night would be like skills night basically. So every team would come in for like an hour and a half break. And they would, it would literally just be skills and drills, all that.

And then maybe play pickup the last like organized pickup, the last like 15 minutes, whatever. So I was very new to the program, but like the kids kind of knew me. Parents really didn’t know who I was, but the CEO of the program who I kind of grew up with, he knew all the parents.

So as I’m running these skill sessions, like everybody’s basically watching me. And the CEO was basically walking around like, oh, this is Jeremy. He, like, he does private sessions. And at that point I really didn’t do private sessions, but like and I did, but like I never, it wasn’t a business thing.

It was just like, yeah, I’ll help you out type of deal. And I think quickly that, that started to grow. So like but also me being at this sports complex that gave me access to a facility. So now I have a facility. I’m the director of operation at the sports complex. So I got around the schedule, so I know when the court’s open, when it’s not, the CEO is kind of like funneling some kids to me.

So now I’m trying to figure out, hey, I can go to your house and do it in a driveway. Hey, I got access to this facility. You don’t have to pay for blah, blah, blah. And, and just as a, I guess I could say quote unquote beginner doing this, like you’re just trying to like, Make it work, I guess. And so I had a full-time position in sports Complex doing AAU is like a, I guess a part-time, full-time thing,

And then I’m like, Hey, I’m doing 3, 4, 5 workouts a week now and this is great, man. I’m like, I’m, I’m making X amount of dollars side cash. Like this is phenomenal. I can’t get over this. So then that just started to grow a little bit and then as parents started, like I think parents would post really on Facebook or, or on Instagram.

Then like, oh, had a great workout with Jeremy and it’d be like just a picture of us, like we worked on ball handling and finishing and shooting. Then like I think that’s your, even though, yes, it’s social media, but because like I think the parents were putting it out was like, that was my word of mouth right then and there and like now more and more people.

We’re seeing it and reaching out, but like, basically I’m from Wheeling, West Virginia, so from Pittsburgh it’s like 50, 55 minutes, so under an hour. So because they were tagging me in this stuff now people back in my hometown area are seeing it and like, how can we get my son and daughter involved, blah, blah, blah.

So I was like, okay. Well, I reached out to my old principal at my grade school and who I’m very close with still to this day. I talked to her weekly, but she let me have access to the gym outside of the school in church time. So now I’m like, okay, well I’m living in Pittsburgh and I’m running a little bit of individual sessions in Pittsburgh, but then 55 minutes away, back in Wheeling, West Virginia, I have access to a gym and I’m my name and business.

Or not even, it wasn’t even a business, just me running basketball. Things just kind of like got out more and more. And so then I’m like, now I start the whole like, man, I’m traveling from Pittsburgh to Wheeling, wheeling to Pittsburgh and like just li like I said earlier, just to make it work. So it got to the point, man, maybe like 25 clients, maybe , like, but I was seeing some of them two, three times a week.

I was seeing others once a week. Like, so it got to the point like, man, this whole AAU thing and coaching fourth and fifth grade boys is really cutting into this whole training thing now. And then it got to the point where like, man, this is, even the sports complex thing is like becoming more and more of a hassle for me.

So I made the executive decision, I got out of the sports complex, so now I’m just strictly a a u and then I’m strictly training, but like it’s not a business. So then as it continued to grow, I probably am at like 30, 35 clients now, like full-time ish. Training wise. So, and I, and I had a really good relationship with the ceo, but like, I didn’t want to like upset him and I just, like, every time on the phone I would just be like, man, it’s getting harder and harder to come to these AAU things.

All this training is really taking off. And like, and I’m not saying I was lying because it was, but like I could do both, but like I really wasn’t with the whole AAU thing too much anymore. And so then he finally, he broke the ice. He’s like, yeah, I don’t even know if AAU would be worth it for you.

And I was like, oh my gosh, thank you so much for saying that because I’ve been wanting to say that for the last, like, two months. So I kind of got out of the AAU thing and then February 17th I started Fade Away Fitness or Fadeaway, February 10th, 2017, started a Fadeaway fitness, I was an actual LLC and basically hit the ground running there.

So then it’s like, okay, well this is my first time. I’m like completely on my own. And now I’m like, okay, well here comes, I just started the social media of at Fade Away fit on Instagram at, on TikTok, Facebook, Twitter, so it could be the same everywhere. I did the website, have the email. So now it’s legit across the board.

So then I start like, I think really, and, and if any like beginner trainer listens to this, like, man, the fir I would say the best stuff that I did at the beginning was posting my kids and like, like successes that they had in workouts with the kids. Like pictures with the kids, but like they could then pr promote it, especially if they’re high school kids to their friends and their following, but then put it on Facebook and they’re, and the parents share it like crazy.

So like that really helped blow my brand up. First. So then once I started getting more and more clients, now I’m like finding a harder and harder time to like, Schedule because I’m just starting to, I’m in, I’m in workouts all day, right? So as that just naturally grew, which and I don’t know how anybody that on here that’s familiar with Wheeling West Virginia, but it’s not significantly a massive area.

So I’m one of maybe , maybe two trainers around here. So there’s not a whole, whole lot of competition, but also I’m the only one that really does anything social media wise, promotion wise, put myself out there. So that really, really helps me for kids. So now let’s, like everybody is seeing it.

Everybody is kind of like wanting to join on. So I’m going to be real at one point I was getting like 40 to 50 new clientele reaching out to me a day, which. . Overwhelming, extremely overwhelming. But at the same time, I’m like, man, I really see the future with this. And I think it could absolutely just get massive.

It’s just now figuring out how to do it. So then I get, I really just like, I don’t know, I, I figured it out a little bit along the way by myself, and I slowly just started doing more and more, but I was traveling and like, it got to the point where like, I got this facility that I’m currently in now, and like I would start in Pittsburgh.

I would drive to Wheeling West Virginia. Then I would go to this, my facility I’m at now in St. Clairsville, Ohio. So 20 minutes from Wheeling, go back to Wheeling, go back to Pittsburgh, stay the night in Pittsburgh. And I’m like, I was in three states , just to do like, just to do like 14 workouts, right? But at the same time, if I don’t do the grind phase, then not no chance I’m at any point where I’m at now.

And but that really helped me grow because now. Me being in three states gave me access to three states market. So especially with the clientele, as it’s starting to really grow my next biggest thing that I really, really needed was my social media to really go. So it started a little bit especially Instagram, but it wasn’t nothing crazy, nothing crazy.

And then Covid hit, so Covid hit, and I’m going to go back to probably one of your last guests you had on here. His name Shane Hennen at Hennen Workouts. So at that time, I literally just posted a video on Twitter of like, me doing a dribbling routine. That’s it. No time, no nothing. Like, and I’m like, oh, this would be a good way for like my clients, just my clients to like maybe work on their game at home.

Since they can’t come in the gym with me, everything’s shut down. So then I did another one the next day and like it did okay, nothing crazy number wise. The third one I did, I like, I did it pretty hard, like full speed on my end, and I just timed it. Nothing. I didn’t ask anybody to do anything else. And it went really well, especially on Twitter.

So I’m like, I’m not an idiot. I think I would do anybody what, what anybody would do. Like I did it the next day. I timed it and I called it the Beat the Trainer challenge. So then I literally just posted a video of me doing a dribbling routine. I timed it, Hey, it took me 17.8 seconds to do this drill. Who can beat me?

Poster video tag at Fadeaway fade on Twitter, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And it went ridiculous. So then, especially Pittsburgh. There were so many AAU programs in Pittsburgh that were following my Twitter account. Thank God a couple of them took it, took that video and sent it to their kids. So then now I’m getting all these videos, I’m just tagged in.

I’m like, what is this ? And then it got to the point where like more and more people were seeing it. So I started, I was just doing it every day, one video a day, and, but I’m like, I’m not an idiot. I’m going to retweet these, share these comment like crazy. And I think that now all of a sudden took my social media following to a place that like I never had access to before.

And I’m like, this is crazy. So I ultimately at the end of the day, I ended up doing a hundred straight video of the Beat the Trainer challenge. And when it got to that point, things were starting to like open back up, like Covid wise, so then I could really just get back into my in-person workouts. And I didn’t have as much time to do these videos anymore.

But when it all said and done, I was all, I was in all 50 states. People were sending videos in and in 42 different countries people were sending their vid dribbling videos. Crazy. And it really, really started to take off. So then that was at the point where I’m starting to post more and more on TikTok.

And then Instagram really like followed talk’s lead with Instagram reels. So after Covid opened I would say that was my biggest point in my business at that point. So, I mean, I’m crushing in person now, and I, I don’t know if I’m happy to say it, but I was doing like 18 to 20 hours each day. Of in-person stuff, which is, that is crazy.

Yeah, exactly. Ridiculous. But I’m like, I see the potential for this, and I’m like, I’m nuts. So like, let’s just, let’s just go, let’s just go. And so then I literally would post my TikTok video or whatever, some breakdown I was doing. But then I, when Instagram came out with Instagram reels, that completely changed I think the social media thing for me.

So I literally just posted the same video to Instagram. But like, because you could add hashtags and add sounds, and I already knew how to do that because of TikTok. Now it gave me access to more and more people. And like, now, here came some of the followers and like now it’s like, whoa, I’m getting 800 followers a day.

This is crazy. So now I’m like, there was days in the summertime of, of last year, 2022 summer especially like June-ish. I was getting, I don’t know, 2000 followers a day, which is. Off of videos. And I’m like, it, it was . It was ridiculous. And I couldn’t, I couldn’t, I felt like I was losing, like, I would open my Instagram and like notifications I would miss just because it was just like, there was an influx of it all.

And like, that was a big turning point because I’m like, okay, well I’m already doing so much in person. So the next thing is like, how can I do more and more events, but I need to have access to more and more people. So when the social media thing came, now I’m like, I’m already doing my local camps that I’m putting on by myself now.

I want, all I have to do now basically is like, Hey post a mixtape maybe from a camp that I did. And just be like, where should I come next? What state, what, what country? What city? Where should we come next? And then people now, because you have a following, people reach out to you, oh, come to California, come to Utah, come to this.

And I’m like, Okay, well, yeah, I’m down. Let’s make it happen now. And that’s been big for me now. So I think and, and like I said, Shane, Hannah and I talk about this literally every day. I said, talk to you better than the phone. I was like, out of probably everybody in the entire world, Shane and I are becoming like best friends just from the basketball space and like, yeah, I’m very I’m very happy for everything that he’s doing.

But like we, we talk about how can we grow, how can we get bigger? How can we expand our brand even more on a daily basis? And it’s cool just to like hear from somebody else who’s in the same path that I’m doing. And, and, and it’s not competition driven because we’re one, we’re both like, we’re both homies, but like we genuinely want each other to succeed.

So that’s where it’s really, really cool to watch it grow. But I’m trying to change, I guess the, the mentality of my business to like camps and event driven. So the last two years, especially last year March, 2022 until the end of the end of the year I was in 28 different states camps, clinics, showcases even people to fly me out for an individual workout, which is crazy, but it’s been cool to really watch that grow because I’m like, now I’m kind of really, truly finding my passion of helping as many people as I can.

But also I really like to travel and I like to see the different parts of the country and the world. And like, I think that’s the direction that I really want to take things. So like I said, as it continues to grow, how can I, how can I impact as many people as possible? So that’s been fun. And so That’s cool.

Yeah. Yeah, it’s been, it’s been a lot of fun watching it grow, like I said, from going to a kid’s house, in their driveway, like working at a kid when I had like four clients in 2017 to like, yep. Now I was in 28 different states. And this year, like I said, it’s already, it’s only March and I, I think I have close to like 56 events already booked.

And like, there’s so many states that I haven’t even been to yet that are on this year’s map. So yeah, I’m really excited for that. But then like just because of like the social media stuff and like the amount that I’ve able been able to get out and do it gave me access to other events. So last July I was able to participate slash like.

I really helped run this event as one of like the main influencers I guess. So it’s called the three point Open. So think of like a dunk contest. So you can get into it, you can compete in it, and if you win, you win money, which is cool, but if you can’t dunk, you can’t get into a dunk contest. But this thing called the three Point Open is basically a high, like high stakes shooting competition that anybody can get into for high, for big money at the end so it costs, it costs a grand last year. It cost a grand to get into it, and if you won, you won a hundred thousand dollars. So this company hit me up. Shout out my guy, Jordan Wartman, who’s the CEO of the Three Point Open, who took a chance on me and, and really like, enjoyed what I did on social media and everything, and.

So he reached out to me and, Hey, we’d love for you to be a part of this and how can you help us grow this? And so as soon as he said, yeah, we’re shooting for a hundred thousand dollars. Like, I mean, I just thought it was a scam. , like, I mean, which pretty much that was like everybody’s main concern. So then I got on the phone with him and like I saw the vision for it all and like what he wanted to do with it all.

And I’m like, man, this sounds sick. So basically, long story short, they wanted me to just shoot video and create content about the event and like kind of drive people to either sign up or just spread awareness about the event. And and I was able to participate in the event then. And so I created one of the first videos I did for the three point open.

Think about like the NBA All Star three point competition, five racks. There’s a money ball at the end. Well, there’s one rack that is a money ball rack. So that’s the, that was the design of the three point open. So there you get, you get to shoot two rounds. So let’s just say you make X amount of shots in round one X amount of shots.

In round two. You take those two scores and combine them for your total score. That would be day one. So then I think last year there was over 110 applicants that, that, that came to this event. That shot. So then, and I love the model of it. So if you, let’s just say you didn’t shoot very well, , and you did not make the top 64 shooters.

You’re done. Go home. Sorry. Appreciate it. But if you were in the top 64 scores throughout day one, you moved on to day two. So now, , you needed to shoot well and take that score and then that puts you into like an NCAA tournament br style bracket. So like the top four scores were basically like your one seeds in each region.

So then it ranked you one through 16 and now there’s an actual bracket to compete against. So on day two it was like competition style. So your one seed shot against your 16 seed. So typically if you’re a one seed, you’re a really, really good shooter. And if you’re a 16, like you have to come up with an upset which there were several of them.

So instead of trying to compete to have the best score in that whole round, you just had to beat the guy you were shooting against to move on. So that went round to 64. Round to 32, sweet 16, elite eight, final four, and then the last two for the championship. So it was really, really cool and I was excited because I had a really big hand in it.

But going back to those social media videos, the very first video that I did, I basically said, Hey, who do you think you can beat me in a shooting competition for a hundred thousand dollars? So when I did that, I turned and grabbed the ball from the racks, and Shaw made a couple, and then I talked about the event.

Shaw made a couple more, and like, it was, it was a really good video. I think it was put together really well, but it went crazy viral, especially on Instagram. But I get a message like four days after I post it from a lady that works at Fox and Friends live on the morning show in Times Square, all that.

So a guy by the name of Pete HEGs, Seth, who is one of the main news anchors on Fox and Friends. Was randomly scrolling through Instagram and my video popped up. So they reached out to me and they wanted to bring me on the air, and I got to compete against Pete Hegseth in a shooting competition live on the Morning show on Fox and Friends.

So I’m like, yeah, that’s sick. That’s like literally I’m crushing the in-person stuff. I’m doing these events, small events and everything. Now I’m traveling some I’m getting the social media following, but like, this gives me major credibility, . And so it was my birthday, June 25th and it, the next day I was supposed to be on on Fox and Friends.

So I’m sitting at a camp with a guy named DJ Sackman running a hoop group event in new, in like the Pennsylvania, New Jersey area. And, and I’m telling them all about it. They’re, they’re all excited for me and everything, but like, Then all of a sudden I get a text message from the vice president of Fox and Friends, Hey Jeremy, I really hate to do this.

And I like, didn’t even want to read the rest of the message. Cause I knew the direction was going to go. That my birthday was the same day that the Roe versus Wade Verdict came out. And like one’s a little bit more breaking news than a three point competition . So I got bumped. So now I’m like, shoot, okay, this is seven days before this actual three point open event takes place.

How can I just, how can I get back on the show? How can I, like, how can I figure it out? How to get on the show? So like, I did the event, everything went great for the three point open. And I’m trying to like message his, his assistant, like, Hey, how can we set this up? Blah, blah, blah. So somehow we ended up getting it set up for July 23rd, which was technically after the event, but like I needed to do it more so for, yeah, for the talk about the event, but.

More so from myself and my brand. And so I got there and July 23rd came early in the morning and said me and him, we did a, a q and a with a couple of the, the anchors live on the air. They brought in a specific court, Anna, hope to put on the outside sidewalk, outside of Times Square. So like, that was a pretty crazy feeling.

But then, and there’s people lining up watching now. And so it was great because we got to talk about like who I am, what I do, what my business is, how the event was, how it was structured. And then me and him, Pete, were, Pete and I were going to. compete in a live shooting competition. So it was going to be best of 10 shots.

So I shoot that he shoots. So I’m like, okay, great. I’m a basketball guy, like I should win this. And like the last, like, couple weeks leading up to that, Pete and I actually had a thousand dollars bet on it, live on the air. Like whoever wins gets a grand. Like, so then a couple days before the event, they actually wanted to lower it down to 500.

So I was like, yeah, whatever. Cool. So me and Pete, Pete and I had a, had a $500 bet on a three point shooting competition live in Times Square. And Pete had said, actually played at Princeton. And I asked him about it. He said he didn’t really play a whole lot, but like, yo, that’s still a division one team, right?

Like you still have to be pretty good to, to be on the team to play there, all that. We start, we start shooting and literally as an, and I went first. So I made, I made my first one. He made his first one. I made my second one, he made his second one. I missed my third shot. So now I’m two for three. Pete made his first eight shots,

[01:31:59] Mike Klinzing: The pressure is on you.

[01:32:00] Jeremy Hays: Yeah, he’s eight for eight. So then I made four. I made five and made six. I made seven by eight. So right now we’re, he’s, I’m seven for eight. He’s eight for eight. And as soon as it gets to shot nine, I made shot nine. He like rimmed out, shot nine. So now we both have one ball left and he like turns and starts talking to the camera saying, I, he is going to beat me.

This, this, this. And so we’re tired. So I ended up shooting. I thought it was a little bit short and it just, just squeaked over the front of the rim. Went in and his shot and it like rolled around the rim and bounced out. So I’m like, man, you couldn’t have scripted this, like literally any better for myself.

So then I won the shooting competition on Fox and Friends Live on the Morning Show. Nice. And took his money and ran and . So that was a big turning point for me too, because now all of a sudden it’s like, like I said, I can’t tell you how many people just like social media messaged or emailed or, or just like, even just to talk about the, the, that show and the experience and literally from start to finish, like I could send you the news clip and it’s maybe, maybe three minutes long, which like felt like an extremely long time when we were doing it.

But like looking back, I’m like, man, we did an interview q and a, this, this, this is this, and we shot a total of 20 shots in three minutes. I’m like, yeah, it’s crazy. It’s crazy. Yeah. Crazy how, how fast I went. But like, that really put me on like a. Pedestal then for my brand. Which then in return, like I said, helped me out with credibility for more and more camps and events and social media.

And like, so like I said, it’s been from Pittsburgh days 2017 to, to now. And like I’m getting even international events and everything, camp’s book, like I’m very happy and very excited for the future and, and just very fortunate and humbled, I guess of like everything I’ve been able to accomplish up to this point.

[01:33:53] Mike Klinzing: Yeah absolutely. All right, before we get out, I want to give you a chance to share how people can connect with you. How, how they can find out more about what you’re doing, share your social media handles, email, website, whatever you feel comfortable with. And then after you do that, I’ll jump back in and wrap things up.

[01:34:07] Jeremy Hays: Perfect. Yeah, anybody have any questions, want to get in touch with me And I actually, I do respond to people , so anybody that reaches out social media wise, I will get back to you. Instagram, TikTok. Twitter, @FadeawayFit, Email Fade@ fadeawayfit.com. Website fadeawayfit.com.

Once again, my name is Jeremy Hayes, the founder and CEO of Fadeaway Fitness, and I severely appreciate you guys having me on the podcast here and kind of being able to share some of my journey and everything I’ve been able to kind of do up to this point.

[01:34:46] Mike Klinzing: Jeremy, we cannot thank you enough for taking the time out of your schedule to jump on with us.

Thankful to Shane for connecting us as well, and to everyone out there, thanks for listening and we will catch you on our next episode. Thanks.