BEN THOMPSON – EMORY & HENRY COLLEGE MEN’S BASKETBALL HEAD COACH – EPISODE 696

Ben Thompson

Website – https://www.gowasps.com/sports/mbkb/coaches/index_mbkb

Email – bthompson@ehc.edu

Twitter – @CoachBPThompson

Ben Thompson is entering his fourth season as Head Men’s Basketball Coach at Emory & Henry College.  During his first season in 2019-20, Thompson guided the Wasps to a berth in the ODAC Tournament and won the most league games of any first-year head coach in program history.

Prior to his arrival at Emory, Thompson spent three seasons as the Head Men’s Basketball Coach at SUNY Canton. He left as the all-time winningest Division III Coach in program history, as well as the fourth-winningest coach in program history.

In the summer of 2018, Thompson led the USA Division III Men’s Basketball National Team on a tour of Brazil.

Before SUNY Canton, Thompson helped guide NCAA Division II Lincoln Memorial University to the National Championship game in 2015-16. That year, the Railsplitters went 34-3, had an undefeated South Atlantic Conference record and won the SAC Tournament and NCAA Division II Southeast Region. Thompson also coached at his alma mater, Virginia Tech, where he helped the Hokies reach the NCAA Tournament and multiple NIT appearances. He has previous coaching stints at Virginia Military Institute, where he was named one of the Top Five Assistant Coaches in the Southern Conference, as well as stops at UNC Greensboro, UNC Pembroke, and Saint Leo University.

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Be sure to jot down some notes as you listen to this episode with Ben Thompson, Men’s Basketball Head Coach at Emory & Henry College in Emory, Virginia.

What We Discuss with Ben Thompson

  • Seeing his Dad coach his team to a state championship growing up in Virginia
  • “Trying to treat people the right way and trying to do things the right way is probably the biggest thing that I learned from my Dad.”
  • “I think part of it is giving our guys experiences that they’ll never forget. And then along the way, when you go through experiences like that and you go through different trips, different opportunities, I think it bonds you as a family.”
  • The blurring of the lines between all levels of college basketball and how good college players really are
  • “As a college coach, our version of being in shape and our player’s version of being in shape are two different things.”
  • “We talk to our guys about being early, loud, and often with communication.”
  • “There’s so many languages throughout the world, but body language is the one that everybody understands.”
  • “The number one person I want to talk to at their school is the high school janitor, because that person really knows more about their character than probably any principal, any coach, any guidance counselor.”
  • “How you treat anybody is how you treat everybody.”
  • “I want a portfolio on a kid, not a photo.”
  • Seeing players in multiple settings during recruiting
  • “You become a head coach and you realize that half of everything you wanted to do just doesn’t work or doesn’t fit into the time schedule.”
  • “At the division two level, I mean, probably only 25% of my job is actual basketball.”
  • “Yes, it’s about recruiting. Yes, it’s about Xs and Os, but you’ve have to also be able to manage your program and manage people.”
  • Improving his ability to adjust and be flexible
  • “Our guys are involved on campus. They’re around. People love our guys. The community loves our team.”

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THANKS, BEN THOMPSON

If you enjoyed this episode with Ben Thompson let him know by clicking on the link below and sending him a quick shout out on Twitter:

Click here to thank Ben Thompson on Twitter!

Click here to let Mike & Jason know about your number one takeaway from this episode!

And if you want us to answer your questions on one of our upcoming weekly NBA episodes, drop us a line at mike@hoopheadspod.com.

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TRANSCRIPT FOR BEN THOMPSON – EMORY & HENRY COLLEGE MEN’S BASKETBALL HEAD COACH – EPISODE 696

[00:00:00] Mike Klinzing: Hello and welcome to the Hoop Heads Podcast. It’s Mike Klinzing here without my co-host Jason Sunkle this morning, but I am pleased to be joined by Ben Thompson, the head men’s basketball coach at Emory and Henry University in Emory, Virginia. Ben, welcome to the Hoop Heads Pod.

[00:00:12] Ben Thompson: Yeah, thanks for having me.

[00:00:15] Mike Klinzing: Absolutely excited to have you on. Want to look forward to diving into all the things that you’ve been able to do in your career. Let’s start by going back in time to when you were a kid. Tell me a little bit about some of your first experiences with the game of basketball.

[00:00:28] Ben Thompson: Yeah, so my father was actually a high school coach and one of my first memories was him winning a state championship in 1991.

When, I guess I was seven or eight, I guess I hadn’t quite turned eight yet. So that was a cool memory. And then just growing up, watching basketball with him, being in the gym as a kid and being at several camps, it’s kind of neat. The first basketball camp I ever attended was actually here at Emory & Henry.

And so it’s kind of neat to kind of come full circle, but I grew up in a coach’s house and I kind of make the joke, I’m pretty sure that at some point dad had a basketball in my crib.  I thought for a while I wanted to be an architect but, came back to basketball pretty quick.

[00:01:16] Mike Klinzing: One of those, you got no choice, right? Yeah, exactly. So like, here it is. It’s in your blood. When you think back to being a kid and just growing up in the game and being around your dad, and then you think about yourself as a coach today, what are some things maybe that you learned from watching your dad that you feel are a part of you as a coach that you took from him?

[00:01:39] Ben Thompson: Yeah, I mean, I think just how to treat people. I’d like to think that I’d treat people if I could treat people half as well as he did, I’d be doing okay. But just the care that he took for people and in high school there’s not the rules that you have in college so he’d go pick guys up and drop guys off at home and he may get back to our home later, but he was making sure that his guys were taken care of.

When he told maybe it may have happened before I was born or I was super little, there was a, a big blizzard and, and dad had a bunch of guys, this was back when he was an assistant that wanted to go hoop and they had canceled school and big blizzard and dad had a four wheel drive truck and he went through the town and got about eight to 10 guys in the bed of the truck while it’s snowing and they went and then they hooped for two or three hours and he’s like I have to get home. You know, but he always, he always took care of people first. You know, and I think sometimes in college basketball we can get lost in trying to win championships or, or winning games or get into the tournament or winning the national title.

And, and sometimes we forget that our student athletes are people they’re not means to an end ends in and of themselves. And so just trying to treat people the right way and trying to do things the right way is probably the biggest thing that I learned from him.

[00:03:10] Mike Klinzing: I think that people part of it and that relationship part of it is certainly something that you hear talked about way more in the coaching profession today probably than when you did when your dad was coaching.

It was more there’s, there was more of that Bobby Knight type style of coaching that was certain, that was certainly more prevalent back then than it is today, and I think that relationship piece has become really critical to being able to connect with your athletes and then get the most out of them.

So when you think about how you build those relationships and what you do to invest in your people, not just your basketball players. What does that look like for you on a day to day basis as the head coach?

[00:03:49] Ben Thompson: Yeah. We try to take more of an organic holistic approach to it.  I’m not sitting guys down in my office and asking them who their girlfriend is, or a bunch of canned questions.

We want it to be as natural as possible. And a lot of that you figure out kind of throughout the recruiting process who guys are, what makes ’em tick. One of the cool things that we have here at Emory & Henry is they have this little golf course on campus. And we maybe have one guy that’s a good golfer, maybe when they’re all awful, you know what I mean?

But they go out there and have the best time and just hang out. I mean, it’s super relaxed. There’s times where there’s seven or eight of ’em playing the same hole together and so just stuff like that. We try to give our guys experiences. We took our team to the Barclay Center last year and to New York City and we’re taking it to Puerto Rico this year. We’re going to play in a NBA arena in Charlotte next season, in Washington DC the following season, we’re going to take a foreign tour. So some of it to me is giving them experiences that they’ll never have. We’ve got a guy on our team whose brother played at the Division one school and never once played in an NBA arena, did a foreign tour and he’s we were D3 now D2 he might have gone to a quote unquote lower level, but he’s going to get to go to Puerto Rico and he’s going to play in NBA arenas, so at the end of the day, His brother went division one, he came here when we were D3 now or D2.

He may have a better experience than his brother did. And so to kind of circle back, I think part of it is giving our guys experiences that they’ll never forget. And then along the way, when you go through experiences like that and you go through different trips different opportunities, I think it bonds you as a family.

So we try to take more of an experiential approach and just getting to know our guys more so on a daily basis and have it happen organically than just sit in my office and I’ve got 12 questions I want to ask you and taking notes and writing it in their contact.

This is their girlfriend, this is their major, this is their interest or whatever. We just try to do it kind of more of like a family holistic approach. You just kind of learn about people as you go and as you go through things together. And so that’s just kind of how we do it.

[00:06:14] Mike Klinzing: It’s building a real relationship, just like you would in the real world, as opposed to trying to sit down and have a formal.

A formal interview process to, to learn all those things. Right. And really getting to know your guys. And you mentioned about recruiting and talking about how that process really starts for you in the recruiting process. And I know one of the things that, we’ve talked to a lot of coaches at different levels, but specifically a lot of division three coaches, just about what you mentioned in terms of the experience and having your guys that you’re recruiting.

First of all, finding them the right fit, but then also helping to educate them. What the experience can be like, because we all know that what’s out there on social media and what people hearing are, are hearing all the time. And when you’re out on the AAU circuit, of course everybody fantasizes and wants to play division one basketball, and yet you talk to so many people at so many different levels, and I think that there’s, there’s a lack of understanding and knowledge of how good D2 basketball is.

So just maybe talk a little bit about how in the recruiting process you have to. For lack of a better way of saying it, educate players and their parents about what the experience can be like when they get to a school like Emory & Henry.

[00:07:23] Ben Thompson: Yeah, so we were division three for a really long time and then last year was our first year as division two and then this year is our second year at division two.

And we’re going into the sac. And so At Division three, it’s kind of the same pitch. You obviously can’t give full scholarships and kids are having to pay a lot of money. At division two, the pitch is a little different because you can give full scholarships potentially and so for us, the league that we’re going into the SAC is really a division one conference that masquerades itself at the division two level. And so one of the issues we’re having now, we had a pretty good year last year. We reached out to over a hundred programs Division one wise and only two would play us.

A lot of people at the low, low, major, and high low major D one and high major D two level understand that in some cases there are better leagues at the D two level than there are at the division one level and better programs and stuff like that. And so the same is true for D three and D two.

It kind of melds together. The bottom 100 of division one and the top 100 of division two are pretty much the same level. The bottom 100 of division two and the top probably. 50 of division three is probably about the same level. And so the public doesn’t understand that and that’s okay, but I would just encourage people to watch games. You can’t assume you know that just because something is division one, division two, division three. Doesn’t mean that it’s necessarily a better level in some cases. It obviously is and I don’t know if this is a great analogy, but one of, one of my favorite things to eat is incredibly unhealthy, but is a big, fat, juicy cheeseburger, right?

So, kind of an analogy that I make is I can go out to a really expensive restaurant and buy a burger, that’s going to cost me 40 bucks. But that doesn’t mean that the burger at Outback is any less, You know what I mean? Like, in some ways, the burger at Outback is a lot better than the one that costs me $40.

Right. Hopefully Outback will reach out and I can do a sponsorship. There you go. Let’s do it. But just because it’s perceived to be a higher level. Or something that you’re quote unquote paying more for doesn’t necessarily mean that it’s the right fit, or doesn’t necessarily mean that it actually is better.

And so we get caught up in the media frenzy of everything. I think we’ve learned over the last few years, not to get too political, but I think we’ve learned over the last decade or so that sometimes we have to do our own research, right? And so what the media tells us isn’t always the best thing at times.

And so whether you’re watching all division I games on ESPN or you’re watching D two, D three, NAIA, juco, I mean, there’s all types of levels and there are really good players at all kinds of levels. There’s a D two guy that played in the NBA finals last year for the Celtics.

You know how many guys never get that opportunity that played at division one or there’s a division three guy that played for the Miami Heat last year. And so There are division two and division three guys that are just as good as Division one and NBA players, but sometimes that level gets forgotten.

So I think just trying to educate yourselves on the level of basketball can be a really good thing. And not belabor the point, but I was coaching a division two school in North Carolina a few years. and we were recruiting a kid in the area and we knew one of the high school coaches.

And so they brought their entire team to the game. And so his teammates had kind of been giving him a hard time, like, Why would you go to division two? You really should be going division one. You’re high major guy like all this stuff. And so they came to the game, they watched the game, and their coach gets back on the bus at the end of the game and he goes, Okay, how many of you guys can play at this levle?

Because they all thought they could. Right. And he was the only one on the bus that raised his hand. And so it was an educational thing for them. They’re like, Man, I didn’t realize these guys were this good. Right. And so I think a lot of it is just people just don’t know and don’t understand. And so I think the more basketball people watch at all levels, not just what’s on espn.

I think can be a benefit for everybody and trying to understand just how good those levels are and how good the experiences can be.

[00:12:16] Mike Klinzing: Absolutely. I think when you start talking about high school players and high school parents, and obviously they’re the people that are making the decision ultimately about where they’re going to go to school, you start asking them or talking to them about, Hey, have you ever seen a division three game?

Have you ever seen a division two game? And I’d say, 80% of the players that I talk to have never been to a Division three game or division two game. And then once they go. And you watch that level of play, and it would be even better, probably even more eye opening if you could get some high school players into an open gym to play against the D two and D three players, and then you’d very quickly find that, wow, this is a completely different level of basketball than what I think the perception is.

And so that’s one of the things that I know we’ve tried to do here on the podcast is just make sure that we’re trying to help people to understand, look, the level of basketball, no matter where you are, if you’re playing college basketball. You’re a heck of a player, and you can’t take that lightly as a high school player.

And so when you’re out there and you’re doing your recruiting, what are some things, Obviously there’s a requisite level of talent that a player needs to be able to have in order to play at the level of where you guys are at, but when you think about some of the intangibles or some of the things that maybe you look for that you know are going to help a player to succeed in your program with you as a head coach, what are some of those things that you look for?

[00:13:36] Ben Thompson: Yeah, for us, I mean there has to be a certain talent level, right? To play in the league that we’re in now, the SAC and division two, you’ve really have to be a division one level guy. Now you can be slipping through the cracks for whatever ever reason, based on height, or you got a funky shot or your parents are in the military and you’ve been to four high schools in four years and it’s not your fault.  Different things like that are potential reasons why someone might be at the division one level, or they’re more slender and they’re not body wise, they don’t look like an NFL wide receiver you’re not jacked or maybe they’re a little overweight or so whatever the reason is the talent level’s have to be there.

So you kind of have to be a division one level ish type guy. But to your point about the intangible, some of the things that we look for you are guys sprinting and running the floor? Are they jogging back? Are guys communicating? And for us communicating just like as a college coach, our version of being in shape and our player’s version of being in shape are two different things.

So what players may think is appropriate communication wise on the court is not for us. I mean, you get into some of these gyms that have. Three, four, 5,000 people. We talk to our guys about being early, loud, and often with communication. If you’re not communicating, I mean, you can’t send a meme or a text message to a guy, you know what I mean?

Like, you have to shout it out. You have to be early, loud, and often you have to let guys know what’s going on. And if you’re not, you got no chance of communicating defensively. So I think how guys run the floor. I think how guys communicate. And then for me, a big, big thing is body language. There’s so many languages throughout the world, but body language is the one that everybody understands.

You know when somebody’s happy, you know when somebody’s sad, you know when somebody’s hurt, when somebody’s frustrated, disappointed, mad, angry, Like, those things go across every language. Right. And so for us, we want guys not that somebody’s never going to have a bad day, but are you a guy that’s barking back to a coach?

Are you a guy that’s barking back at officials? Are you a guy that’s being demonstrative with your teammates? Or when you miss a shot it looks like you know your dog just died, or your world is ending, or when you get taken out what is your body language on the bench when you get taken out?

When something goes right, are you a front runner? Like you’re into it when things are going right. And then you’re the first guy to deflate when things aren’t going right. And so the body language piece is really big for us. And what I’ve found over the years is to a certain degree, skill sets can be taught.

It’s really hard to get someone from having bad body language to having good body language. That’s one of the hardest things as a coach. And so innately you know, you can move the needle a little bit, but innately, someone either has good body language or they don’t. That’s big for us.

And then I tell people this all the time at our elite camps when I’m recruiting the character piece is really important and, and a lot of times the body language can help with help us determine some of that. But the body language is big and character is big.  We’re a family here. Our hashtag is the family.

Nike I’m wearing it right now has given us our own family logo. My family’s around a lot. I’ve got a two year old son and a six month old daughter. My wife’s around and so we want guys with high character in our program. And so one of the biggest things that I look for when I go talk to a kid the number one person I want to talk to at their school is the high school janitor.

Because that person really knows more about their character than probably any principal, any coach any guidance counselor. And this is kind of the analogy that I make, and all of us were in high school, so let’s not be naive about the thing. If kids are in a group and they’re talking about things they shouldn’t be talking about, and a principal or a coach walks by what normally happens, yeah, it all shuts down.

It shuts down. But if it’s a janitor or someone that they don’t perceive that this isn’t true, but they don’t necessarily perceive the janitor to be someone that can help them get where they want to. So how you treat everybody is how you treat anybody or how you treat anybody is how you treat everybody, right?

So we want guys in a program that treat people the right way. Some people don’t necessarily perceive a janitor to be someone that can help them earn a scholarship. But that’s the exact right person that I want to talk to. They’re going to put on their best foot forward with people they think can help ’em, the principal, the AD, the coach all those types of things.

I want to know how you’re treating the people that you perceive cannot help you. And so if the janitor, custodian, cafeteria, workers, grounds crews, if those people tell me that somebody’s a good kid, that they treat people the right way, then in most cases they’re a pretty good kid and they treat people the right way.

And so those are just some of the things that we look for.

[00:19:11] Mike Klinzing: Yeah, that character piece I think is really huge when you start talking. Guys that you’re going to be around for four years and that you’re going to be coaching and working with, and they’re going to be around your family and you’re going to count on them to bring their best every single day.

That that character piece to me is a huge part of, of building a good program at whatever level it is that you have. And obviously in college as opposed to high school, you have some ability to be able to recruit and start that process in the recruiting and bring in the kind of guys that you want.

When you’re out on the road and you’re looking at players, how much do you weigh AAU versus high school? Do you prefer watching a player in one setting or the other? Do you look for different things in each setting? Just how do you balance out looking at a player with their high school team versus with their AAU team?

[00:19:56] Ben Thompson: Yeah. I heard a guy I worked for in the past use this analogy, and so it’s kind of, I want a portfolio on a kid, not a photo. Right? And so like, if somebody’s turning in an artwork or a, a photography assignment or whatever a lot of people can draw one painting really well, or take a really good picture. Right? But can they do it over the course of different venues and different environments and those types of things and different tools, whether it’s acrylics or water painting. And that’s kind of maybe a bad analogy, but the portfolio thing is what we look for.

So I want to see a kid in aau. I want to see a kid with a team and a lot of times that they don’t practice a lot how do they do in that setting especially for bigs in  aau because they rarely get the ball . Right. Like it’s just how it is.

So bigs don’t get the ball and guards over dribble all the time in aau. And so I want to see how guys handle those situations. And so for us, AAU kind of there’s some really good AAU programs out there. There’s some really good AAU coaches out there. But for us, AAU is kind of an elimination thing.

Like, is this kid good enough for us to continue recruiting him? Is this character good enough? Is he a good enough player? It kind of gets guys on the map to some. But then we also want to see ’em with their high school team at a high school practice, in a showcase, in a workout, on campus with our guys.

We want to see them in as many settings as possible. And you know, here at Emory and Henry, it costs 50 grand basically to go to school. So if I’m going to invest 200 grand in somebody, I’m not going to see ’em play one AAU game and then just go up and offer . You know what I mean? Like Yep. Like I didn’t do that with my wife, you know?

I didn’t see her just walk up to her and say, Hey I want to spend the rest of my life with you because I’ve just seen you one time, or we’ve been on one date, and I get some of the stuff that people fall in love, first time, whatever. I get all that stuff. But for me having to kind of be the CEO of our program.

Is it a good business decision to invest 200 grand into somebody I just watched play for 15 minutes. Right? And some coaches are like that, but for us, I feel like to be a good steward of our program, that’s not in our best interest. And so I want to see ’em play multiple AAU games. I want to see ’em in a showcase.

I want to see ’em in a practice. I want to see ’em with their high school team. I want to see ’em on our campus, how they interact with our guys. I think seeing them in as many settings, I mean, not to repeat what I just said, but I just want to see them in as many settings as possible to know as much that I can know what I’m getting in a kid before they step on campus.

[00:23:00] Mike Klinzing: No, that makes total sense. I think when you start looking at how do you evaluate, the more touch points you have, the better your analysis is going to be. And that being said, It’s not a perfect science, as we all know, so you continue to just keep working and try to perfect your process. Let’s go back in time a little bit, Ben, to earlier in your career.

Talk a little bit about some of the things that you learned along the way as you were building your coaching resume as an assistant coach that you feel have served you well now as a head coach.

[00:23:29] Ben Thompson: Yeah, I mean, I think every person you work for, sometimes people won’t say this part of it. I think every person you work for, you learn stuff that you like, that you would do and you want to keep, and you learn stuff that you don’t like and you don’t want to do, and so you just kind of discard it.

And so I think working for different people, you kind of take the best nuggets from each one or what you feel are the best nuggets from each one. And you do your own research and you do your own investigation and into different things on what you want to do. And so I’ve learned some good things from every guy that I’ve worked for and I’ve worked for some really good people, and then you have these ideas of grandeur when you become a head coach and you think you have the world figured out and you know what it’s going to be like, and this is just how it’s going to be, right? And then you become a head coach and you realize that half of everything you wanted to do just doesn’t work or doesn’t fit into the time schedule.

You just have to modify. And so yeah, I don’t know that I’m quite answering your question, but I just think you try to pick up on different pieces from the different people that you work for. And maybe one guy has some really good things offensively but defensively he is not real great.

And so another guy you work for is really good defensively, but offense struggles and so not just that. And I think in this day and age, too many people. Too many coaches, young coaches especially, get so wrapped up in the recruiting piece that in a lot of ways, they’re not prepared to be a head coach when they become a head coach because all they’ve done is just recruit, recruit, recruit, recruit, you know?

And so I think as much professional development as you can do I think trying to learn from people holistically how they lead a program. It’s not just about getting players, right? It’s about keeping them, It’s about them growing and maturing and getting better. And so I think some of the things that helped me along the way, and I’ve had bumps as a head coach but some of the things that helped me along the way was that being able to watch specifically how my bosses ran a program.

It goes beyond the Xs and Os. It goes beyond recruiting, I mean, At the division two level. It may be a little higher than this at the Division one level, but at the division two level, I mean, probably only 25% of my job is actual basketball. Yeah. You know, the other 75 is trying to figure out you’ve got on campus meetings, you’ve got compliance, you’ve got the recruiting piece, you’ve got fundraising, you’ve got events that you’ve have to attend, you’ve got speaking engagements, you’ve got all these other things, and so can you compartmentalize, can you put the most important things in front of what needs to get done?  Can you be interrupted and circle back to something later? Like there’s different pieces and components of running a program that if you only focus on the Xs and Os and the recruiting piece, you’re going to miss and you’re going to have to learn when you become a head coach.

And sometimes guys only get one opportunity to become a head coach because they’re trying to figure it out right as they go. And then by the time they figured out they’re no longer a head coach and they may not get that opportunity again. So I think trying to learn, I mean, yeah, the recruiting is important.

Obviously the Xs and OS is important, but for all the coaches out there, I think that trying to figure out how to be a CEO of a program and holistically manage everything that comes at you is a piece sometimes that I think gets left in the dark. And so I think the more that guys can work on developing that aspect of it how would, how do you handle it when. 40 minutes into a practice and somebody comes in and, and says, Hey, so and so has to sign up for this class in the next 20 minutes, or they’re going to be ineligible, you know what I mean? Or you’re not going to be able to practice today. Right? Or, Hey, I know that you’re in this meeting, but campus needs the gym for something and you have 20 minutes less to practice today, or you’ve got 30 more minutes to practice today, or you’ve got a disciplinary issue that comes up. Or, Hey I know that practice ends at five, but I need you go to speak at this event at 5:30 and it’s three o’clock and you have to come up with what am I going to speak on?

There’s a lot of things that come at you as a head coach, and so I think trying to prepare yourself, you can’t prepare for all of it. I get that, but trying to at least have in your mind some of the things that you want to do and accomplish and, and how you’re going to handle time management.

I think it help people who want to become head coaches as well. Yes, it’s about recruiting. Yes, it’s about Xs and Os, but you’ve have to also be able to manage that program and manage people. And the time management piece is really crucial for that.

[00:28:51] Mike Klinzing: So I know and understand that as a head coach, you’re constantly growing and learning and trying to improve, but when you think about where you are as a head coach compared to where you were on day one, As a head coach and you think about building your philosophy and you can take the philosophy, whether you want to say it kind of as that CEO of the entire program or whether you think about how you wanted your teams to play out on the floor offensively and defensively.

How long was it before you felt pretty comfortable with, Okay, I’ve kind of settled into a rhythm here and I have an idea. Who I am as a coach and what I want my program to look like. Was that something that you felt like you had a handle on pretty quickly? Is there a moment where you could point to, Hey,  I figured it out, or just what’s that evolution been like for you?

[00:29:40] Ben Thompson: Yeah, I thought I had it figured out around year three. And then we had a really good team when I was at SUNY Canton returning, and I got the job at Emory and Henry. And after I left pretty much our entire team, we had returned almost everybody. They went to the NCAA tournament the year after I left.

And so I was happy for those guys. But then I got here and then Covid. You know, And so much for philosophy. I’m much more confident and secure in what I want to do. And the culture piece of our program, that piece I’m not going to waver on.

I think you have to, there’s ebbs and flows and you have to adjust. I think earlier in my career, I was more willing to, Oh, well if this guy is a good enough player we can we’ll just make him be a better kid, you know? And that doesn’t always equate.

And so the character piece I’ve matured on as something I’m not going to waver on. I’m not as cement as they used to be like it used to be. No, we’re just going to only play man to man defense. Right. So well we’ve got some guys who can’t guard a chair at times.  Right? So you’re going to have to do some things differently, so I think being comfortable in adjusting is something that I used to be uncomfortable with. And so I think that’s helped me grow. I think one of the things I did early on that I made mistakes on is I tried to schedule like as hard of games as possible.

And there’s a time for that, but we weren’t ready for that. And so my thought was, we have to get to the NCAA tournament, we have to get to the NCAA tournament. And at division three there’s only like 18 of those schools that get at large bids. So if you don’t win your league, it’s not like division one where there’s 40 at large bids.

And so I just wanted to put together the toughest schedule in the country and just assumed we would win games and get to the NCAA tournament, win a national championship and things are going to be great. Right? and so I think I’ve matured a little bit on the scheduling and I’ve gotten more cerebral in that area.

Recruiting more char cter guys. And I think because I’ve had to adjust so much. I think just being more comfortable in making adjustments and knowing what you want to get out of get out of a practice or out of a team or whatever. I’m not as concrete, Oh, we’re doing this this day and that day and that day.

Now I just try to kind of have more of a pulse on our team. And so it causes you to adjust more. But I think that’s probably been my biggest area of growth as a head coach.

[00:32:37] Mike Klinzing: I’m guessing that flexibility comes from confidence of having been through experiences and sort of understanding, hey, I can make an adjustment here and we can still move forward, or we can even maybe advance beyond what we might have with my original plan.

As you start looking at things, I’m guessing that confidence has a big role in that.

[00:32:54] Ben Thompson:. Yeah, I think so.

[00:32:58] Mike Klinzing: I want to wrap up with one final two part question. So part one is when you look ahead over the next year or two, what do you see as being, being your biggest challenge? And then part two, when you get outta bed in the morning and you think about being the head coach at Emory and Henry, what’s brings you the most joy?

So your biggest challenge and then your biggest joy.

[00:33:20] Ben Thompson: Yeah, so I think the biggest challenge for us is the transition to division two and really the league we’re going into is really closer to a division one league. And so, Last year we had two scholarships. This year we have four.  Next year we’ll have around six. In the following year, we’ll have around eight, and we’re in a league where almost everybody has eight to 10. So that transition and trying to figure out how to try to be successful with maybe less resources than what other schools have is the biggest challenge.

For me, the biggest joy is getting to be around our guys and just seeing how many of them and how the program has just grown. When we got here, Three, four years ago, whatever it was, I think the team GPA was like a 2.2 and they’d had some success on the court. But I think we’ve done a good job.  Our team GPA last year was like a 3.3, so we’ve done a lot better in the classroom, in the community., that love and have embraced the community and campus.

I mean, people light up when they see our guys. And it’s just a cool, cool thing to see. We started to have some success on the court. And so obviously that’s important, but I just love how integrated into the community our guys are and how revered they are. Not because they won a national championship, but because of who they’ve become as young men.

To me, that brings me the greatest joy. Yeah. That’s

[00:35:17] Mike Klinzing: Yeah. That’s awesome. That’s great stuff. And I think when you start talking about being able to use the game of basketball, that you love to be able to have that kind of impact and help your players to grow, not just on the basketball court, but off and integrate and become the kind of people that they want to become and that you want them to.

That to me is what it’s all about. Before we get out, Ben, I want to give you a chance to share how people can reach out to you, find out more about you and your program, whether you want to share social media, email, website, whatever you feel comfortable with, and then I’ll jump back in and wrap things up.

[00:35:47] Ben Thompson: Yeah. We’re obviously on the internet at gowasps.com. Twitter, our team handle is @Ehcbb on Twitter and Instagram. I think my Twitter is @CoachBPThompson. My email is bThompson@ehc.edu, which is also on our website so people can feel free to reach out or DM or email or whatever works for them.  Be happy to hear from anybody.

[00:36:16] Mike Klinzing: Perfect. Ben cannot thank you enough for taking the time out of your schedule this morning to jump on with us. Really appreciate it and to everyone out there, thanks for listening and we will catch you on our next episode. Thanks.