BRANDON GOBLE – FOUNDER & CEO OF JUCO ADVOCATE- EPISODE 504

Brandon Goble

Website – https://jucoadvocate.com/#home

Email – BRANDON@JUCOADVOCATE.COM

Twitter – @jucoadvocate

Brandon Goble is the CEO and Founder of JUCO Advocate, which connects coaches from around the country with players from around the world.

Brandon started JUCO Advocate In May of 2016. Since then, Brandon and his team have been working diligently to help players get the exposure they needed to earn scholarships at all levels, and in the background, developing something that will help change the way that players get recruited, and how coaches recruit them. Brandon believes all players should have a chance to be seen while helping coaches find those players that they might have otherwise overlooked and missed out on.

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Take some notes and learn from this episode with Brandon Goble, CEO and Founder of JUCO Advocate.

What We Discuss with Brandon Goble

  • Growing up an Air Force Brat and a fan of Penny Hardaway
  • Getting into basketball analytics in college
  • Looking into Tempo Free statistics
  • How studying the stats on his own and tweeting about what he found led to his first opportunity to talk to a D1 Coaching Staff
  • Why you shouldn’t be afraid to have someone tell you know
  • Some of the unnoticed stats he found and how coaches can use them
  • The story of how JUCO Advocate started with one player
  • Brand Growth vs Business Growth
  • How he built and grew JUCO Advocate on Twitter
  • Focusing on a wide range of players rather than just elite D1 prospects
  • Why he runs camps in Africa and for inner city kids here in the US
  • Building long term relationships with the players JUCO Advocate serves
  • Offering more free services while expanding the business into new areas
  • How his approach to business differs because he didn’t come directly from the basketball world to the business world
  • How he and his business partner Nathan complement each other
  • “Our company goes out and makes sure that everybody that wants to be a part of basketball can at least be a small part of it”
  • The importance of honesty with players and coaches to maintain credibility

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THANKS, BRANDON GOBLE

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TRANSCRIPT FOR BRANDON GOBLE – FOUNDER & CEO OF JUCO ADVOCATE- EPISODE 504

[00:00:00] Mike Klinzing: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to the Hoop Heads Podcast. It’s Mike Klinzing here with my cohost Jason Sunkle. And tonight we are pleased to welcome from Juco Advocate, Brandon Goble to the Hoop Heads Pod. Brandon.

Brandon Goble: [00:00:10] I appreciate you guys having me on.  

Mike Klinzing: [00:00:13] Absolutely. We are excited to be able to have you on and dive into the things that you’re doing in the game.

Want to start off by going back in time title when you were a kid, how’d you get into the game of basketball first? What do you remember about some of your first experiences?

Brandon Goble: [00:00:26] You know, it’s funny, my introduction to the game is, is super different than, than a lot of people’s mind did not start. When I was really young, I was an air force brat.

And so we lived all over the world and, and which is funny because that experience has now. Become a huge part of, of why I do what I do currently. But it didn’t really have anything to do with getting into basketball. Like I kind of figured out that I was better at doing stuff in the water. And so, you know, I swam and played water polo at a really high level and.

And so when I was growing up, like I [00:01:00] was interested in basketball, I was watching the NBA and, you know, same thing as is, you know, I’m 38. So, you know, in that era, who is your guy? I mean, penny was my guy back then. Right. It was the first pair of shoes that I ever bought was, was the pennies. And, and

Mike Klinzing: [00:01:16] Mike does a really good impression of the commercial.

You’d like to hear it. Did you have a little penny doll?

Brandon Goble: [00:01:20] penny doll? You know, I didn’t, I didn’t have the little penny doll, but I actually, this year on our pocast, I got to interview penny. And so I got to talk about buying my, my shoes for the first time. And, and I, I, I neglected to tell him that, like, that those things fell apart.

In like three weeks, I was devastated that I’d bought the I’d saved up all this lawnmowing money to buy these pennies and, and they were not well-made, but So, yeah, I mean, basketball for me was, was like a, like a second breath. So, you know, I ended up when I went to college is really where I kind of fell back in love with the game and, and especially in the college game and in, in a really [00:02:00] different way, because I really fell in love because the analytic side of it I read basketball on paper.

I, I dug into a lot of the math side of it. I did a lot of my own math. And that’s really what kinda got me into basketball. You know, I was a fan for sure, but really diving into the analytics side of it. And that’s, that’s really kind got what got my start.

Mike Klinzing: [00:02:19] What were some of the first things that you were looking at from an analytics standpoint?

What were some of that, when you first started going into that world, what were some of the things that you wanted to find out or some of the things that you noticed, or some of the stats that jumped out at you were like, man, Hey, I didn’t, I didn’t realize that this had such an impact on the game?

Brandon Goble: [00:02:35] Right. Like to, to, to put everybody on the same level playing field, because we were always looking at points per game and, and all that sort of thing. And so the idea of tempo free statistics just stood out to me is like the super cool thing that made it so that you could actually look deeper into what was going on in basketball.

And I, and I, I was a big baseball fan before. And [00:03:00] so, you know, a lot of, some of those sabermetrics and stuff were really starting to take off before it really did in basketball. And so I was into that. And then, you know, I’m watching this basketball stuff kind of develop and, you know, we interviewed Ken Pom and I talked about like, you know, just falling in love with that website and kind of really digging into where those numbers came from and what they meant and how you could apply them in scouting situations and all that kind of stuff.

And so. I just started tweeting about it one day from a, from a personal account and a staffer at a D one school saw it and he’s like, Hey, do you want to come in and talk to our coaches about this stuff? We don’t really know anything about it. And I was like, yeah, sure. And and it was so naive at the time to like really understand the world of college basketball and like how goofy that was like some dude off the internet was, you know, gonna come in and start putting together these reports and different stuff like that.

So I got, oh gosh, that would have been well, it was, it was Larry Stacy’s first year at Colorado [00:04:00] state. So whatever year that was and and yeah, started doing that and working with some of the assistants and helping with some reports stuff and doing deep dive analytics and, and a shot charting and, and all these different things.

And, and that’s, that’s where I really got kind of connected to basketball, but No, I didn’t know anybody at the time. I, it was like, yeah, I knew, I knew the staff that I was doing some stuff with, but that was it. You know, my, my broader perspective of, of the college basketball world, like hadn’t really developed yet.

But I was in a position where I was having fun doing it. And, and, you know, thought that it was like, Hey, you know, this is, this is cool, but like this isn’t going to be my thing that I do. Right. Like, you know, I’ve got this corporate job. And which was awful. And but I didn’t, I didn’t see basketball is like a, like a future career for me, you know growing up like, like, you know, my dad was, you know, in the air force and he’s retired Colonel and he was so conservative with everything.

It was like, well, what you do is you go to [00:05:00] college and then you get a job and then you work that job until you’re finally, like, I’ve saved enough money to not work this job. And then you retire and then that’s it. Right. I mean, that’s, that’s just what you do. And so I’m looking at it. Yeah. I’m looking at it going like, all right, well, I guess this is the job I’m going to do until I’m 60 something that’s sucks.

But I didn’t know what else I was going to do, you know, I I’m like, all right, I’m good at this thing. And so the basketball thing was just like this nice release for me to be able to go and do things that I enjoyed. And then oddly enough, just fate so happened that met somebody that kind of sent me a spiraling down this path that I’m on now, what six years ago.

And here we are today

Mike Klinzing: [00:05:41] at first time you go into the, whatever the basketball office, and you’re going to sit down and you’re going to start sharing some of the numbers of the things that you had put together. Was there, was there a strong feeling of like, man, I’m not really sure that I belong here or, or was it more, as you [00:06:00] said that you were.

So naive. You’re like, man, I’ve kind of figured this out and these guys really could use what I’m having, which, which one of those better, more, more accurately describes kind of how you were feeling that first time you walked in and sat down with the coaching staff.

Brandon Goble: [00:06:12] The second thing, like I think if I’d have gone in and been intimidated and just be like, ah, I don’t like this.

You know, I don’t know if I’d have kept doing it, but you know, fortunately my, my job, my real job was you know, talking to a lot of people and, and kind of explaining a lot of things and analyzing things and pulling things apart and, and, you know, getting people to understand it. And so it really wasn’t that different for me.

And I’m not somebody that’s ever really ever been intimidated by talking to anybody. So for me, like these guys, I, they, they weren’t on like a pedestal for me, even though they were wonderful people and, and have now become long, you know, lifelong friends and all that kind of stuff. Like I just, I don’t know.

I was naive enough to not be intimidated, which was. Cause now when I work with you on coaches and things like that, and, and I’ll say, you know, Hey, let’s get [00:07:00] on the phone with so-and-so or, you know, come over here, I’ll introduce you to whatever. And, and, and and you know, you get the, bleary-eyed like, oh my God, look on their face because these are the guys that, you know, they’ve, they, these are their idols, right?

These are the guys they look up to it’s, you know, whatever. And I’m like, eh,

Mike Klinzing: [00:07:17] it’s funny. It’s funny that you say that. I don’t know that we feel quite exactly the way you just described it, but there certainly is some of that with the podcast where there’s people that we’ve had on that we would have never had the opportunity to talk to.

If we didn’t have the platform, it’s not like you can just call somebody up and say, I want to talk to so-and-so. But when you have something that you can offer them and you can have this platform, it makes it much easier to at least be able to get to them. And. Have that conversation, which has been interesting.

It’s not something that we expected when we started it. We kind of didn’t even know we didn’t even start it as an interview show. So it was a completely different show when we first started it. But it’s [00:08:00] just, it’s just interesting how that particular piece of it has evolved where it’s like, yeah, we might as well reach out and see what’s the worst thing that’s going to do.

If somebody is going to say somebody is going to say no.

Brandon Goble: [00:08:09] Yeah, yeah. I think that’s a thing for young coaches too, is that they’re always so terrified of somebody telling them no, you know, that, that, that it’s now that they’re instantly intimidated and I mean, a seasoned head coach can smell that a mile away.

And you know, if you’re, if you’re not intimidated, if you just like, Hey, you know what, I’m going to jump into this thing with two feet. If I get told no, oh, well, life goes on, you know? And that’s just kind of how I’ve approached. Everything that we do at this point is like, you know, I kind of always joke with people.

It’s like I say, what I want. I don’t worry about. You know, whatever. And , I just am not afraid to ask. And you know, when, when you kind of approach it that way, you’d be surprised how many times it actually works out. So what were some of the

Mike Klinzing: [00:08:53] things that, in those first few, with the first few coaching staffs that you met with, [00:09:00] and you start sharing some of the things that you were finding and some of the analytics that you were looking at, what were things that they were looking for that they previously didn’t have access to?

Can you go back and think about what were some of the things that you were bringing to the table that were different from what they already had or what they had access to?  

Brandon Goble: [00:09:18] You know, for me, it was a lot of the things that I talked about were not normal scout stuff. Right. So, you know, when you’re talking about ball screen coverages, and you’re talking about all that stuff, you know, I looked at it and I’m like, cool, like do your thing.

But. You know, here’s something else you should look at. And so focused a lot on, you know, like who are the worst foulers on that team, especially in the starting five, spend your first like three or four minutes just going after that guy, get them out of the game. And they’re like, why? And I’m like, well, here’s the math that says efficiency-wise when that guy’s not in the game, their win percentage drops to whatever.

Right. As compared to [00:10:00] when he’s in the game, get them the hell out of there. I don’t care how many points you score in the first three or four minutes, give them two fouls. And now they’re, you know, you’re playing, they’re playing a lineup that they haven’t been planning on playing very much the entire week.

And, and I mean, adapting on the fly, like that is not something that guys like really like to do, especially when it’s one of their starting five guys. And so it was different things like that, that I can. You know, focused more on was like, you know, Hey, here’s, here’s what happens to win percentage is based on you know, lineup changes or did a lot of shot charting stuff, like figuring out like who couldn’t shoot from the left side of the floor.

You know, there was, there was a kid that we put together a whole scout chart thing on, and it was basically like, I don’t know if this guy’s cross-eyed or what, but like he cannot shoot from the left side of the floor overload and just push him there. He’ll take the shot. He’s not afraid to take it. It’s just not going in, you know?

And so there’s a lot of that kind of stuff. And that was, that was even what probably made it good though, is that I was coming from [00:11:00] a, not a basketball background. And so I had a little bit of fresh eyes, I think, on how to affect outcomes. And so it was different. Like there was a lot of things that we talked about that just, weren’t typically part of the discussion.

And so that was, you know, that was, that was kind of the thing that, that really set the whole ball in motion for me, as far as, as really just falling in love with the game and watching more basketball than anybody and spending a lot of time, like really honing my analytics side of things and honing my own algorithms and, you know, different stuff like that.

And and I, I just so happened that, that, you know, as I was going through that process and trying to figure out what I wanted to be when I grew up Matt Solomon Hina. And he’s now the, the Juco advocate logo. But Solomon was a player that wanted a walk on and the coach didn’t, wasn’t interested in looking at walk-ons and stuff.

And I said, well, I don’t, I don’t know anybody in basketball, outside of these five guys that I see all the time. But I’ll work [00:12:00] it out and we’ll film it and and we’ll send it around and, and see what happens. And Solomon was so different because he’d been in the military for the past six years. So Solomon was like 24 or something like that.

And his clock had stopped because he joined the air force. And so there was kind of this natural affinity to him where I’m like, I don’t know what I’m doing, but I like you. And I like the fact that you’re an ex-military guy and you know, I’m going to try and help you. I don’t know how, but, you know, we’ll figure it out.

And so. Send his stuff down. And I had a buddy Sam Winooski that was down at Midland junior college. And he was actually the guy that had reached out to me on Twitter and said, Hey, you know, you should come talk to these coaches. And so I said, Sam, you’re the only other guy I know in basketball. Like, what do you think about this kid?

And he’s like, yeah, no, he can walk on here. And and he did. And, and so Solomon ended up starting form down there at Midland and, and he calls me one day and he’s like, all right, like I need help with my D one recruitment. And I’m like, that’s neat. How are you going to do that? [00:13:00] And he says, why don’t I, I need you to help me.

And I’m like, ah, here we go. And and so I jumped on that, that personal Twitter account. And I sent something about 2,800 tweets with Solomon’s film. And so what I would do is I actually went to verbal commits at the time cause Nathan and I didn’t know each other yet. And and I just went and looked at every D one coach that he followed and then I tweeted it.

And so for that year for Solomon, there is not a division one coach that didn’t get tagged in a tweet by me. And and so I would just watch and see if anybody interacted with the tweet. And I figured, well, that’s probably the coach clicking on the link and then I’d send another link and another link.

And then sure enough, you know, I I’d start getting DM saying, all right, who is this kid? And and so Solomon ended up playing three years of division one basketball and, and all that and got his master’s and is a guidance counselor now at a, at a school. But when we got, you know, kind of him taking care of as far as going to [00:14:00] school, it just was kind of looking around saying, you know what?

I bet there’s a bunch of other kids that like have cool stories and, and I want to help tell those stories. I want to help more guys go to school. Like it was such a fulfilling thing that, that Solomon was able to go to school. I ended up helping three or four other guys from that same team. Tweeting the holy heck out of their stuff.

And and I had met Daniel who was now an NBA agent through this process and had just randomly DMD him. And he’s like, yeah, no, I’ll help you, you know, retweet some stuff and send it out. And so I just called him one day and I’m like, Hey, I got this idea. Like, I want to start this thing where it’s like focusing on junior college and helping as many kids as possible.

He’s like, yeah, sure, cool. Like, I’ll help you out with that. Like, here’s, you know, 2000 phone numbers. And and so we, we kind of started this thing and, and, you know, Dan has since gone his own way and, and runs his own company and he’s amazing. And we still talk every week and do some work together, but just started really kind of pounding after it, not having any idea what it was going to.

Or what it was going to [00:15:00] turn into. I was just like, I don’t know. Let’s help him to as many kids as we can and we’ll figure it out. No, we didn’t make any money. You know, we, we don’t take money from kids. We don’t, we don’t do anything like that. And it was just, it was a spreadsheet. I had this, I had this Excel spreadsheet and kids at DME and I’m like, okay, I put, got you on the spreadsheet.

And then I, and then I’d watch their film. And I’m like, all right, this kid, I think he’s this level, this kid, I think he’s at level. And I had the experience of watching an insane amount of basketball and it all levels and like really breaking it down and organizing it. So, you know, I had a really good sense of, you know, what level a lot of guys were and, and things like that, and just started tweeting at people.

And then people started following for some reason, you know? And and, and now here we are power the internet. Yeah. It’s crazy. Social media is nuts. Like, I, I. People always ask, like, you know, okay, well now, you know, between, between Nathan you know, running verbal commits and me running Juco advocate, all of our brands combined, I mean, we’re [00:16:00] doing hundreds of millions of social media impressions and everybody’s like, well, how am I?

And I don’t know. I know isn’t that true.

Mike Klinzing: [00:16:07] I think that is, there’s nothing true or that’s ever been said, because I know just from trying to do our social media and you’re putting stuff out there and you’re basically throwing things against the wall. And sometimes I hit on things that I think we’re pretty well.

And then other times I feel like I’m spinning my wheels. And then as, you know, things change and the way things get measured and the way that different posts get interacted with and whatever. And so it’s just, it’s amazing what it can do. And yet it can also be frustrating because you don’t always know if what you’re doing.

Is right. Especially when you’re trying to do it on your own, and then you go out and hire somebody, but you have no idea if that person that you’re hiring knows what they’re doing or doesn’t know what they’re doing. And then anytime you put out a lot of posts, you know, how time consuming that is to create those posts and craft them and make sure that you’re [00:17:00] tagging the right people and getting them in the right places.

And then there’s not an immediate monetary payoff in social media. It’s much more of a long game that you’re building and trying to build that network and all that. It’s just, it’s a very interesting place to be when you’re utilizing it for your business, because you don’t always know what you’re getting and what you’re doing and whether or not you’re doing it.

Right.

Brandon Goble: [00:17:22] Right. Yeah. It’s it’s a weird thing because, you know, especially with ours, like it, it was so organic and, and, you know, there’s. So many kids that need help with stuff. And there’s a lot of, you know, coaches that are just constantly looking everywhere and it just, you know, I think we kind of hit it at the right time as well, which timing is, is incredibly important on all this stuff where we just kinda hit it at a time where we were doing something a little different than a lot of people were, were utilizing it for.

And we were, we were approaching it from a very different business standpoint as well. You know, where that’s kind of what we’ve always done is we disrupt the model for making money and, and how, and you know, that has [00:18:00] helped a lot as well. But at the same time, it also makes, you know, maybe business growth is a little bit slower, but brand growth has been significantly larger.

So, you know, there’s, there’s a, there’s a give and take there, but for us, it was always you know, the long-term goals you know, what is, what is 10 years down the road look like as opposed to next. And, and, you know, we’ve really maintained that even as we’ve, you know, the business side has grown and really taken off we’re still looking at, you know, what is 10 years down the road look like?

And you know, how are we going to impact not only this game, but this planet and impact just people in general with what we do and, and what can we be doing now that is going to have the most impact 10 years from now, as opposed to just, you know, making, making a few bucks next year and, and, you know, doing whatever, right.

And when did you get to that?

Mike Klinzing: [00:18:52] When did you get to the point where it was no longer kind of fly by the seat of your pants? And like, Hey, I’m just trying to help this [00:19:00] one kid, and we’re doing this and trying that and seeing if we can get a hold of this coach, at what point did you start to realize that, Hey, this is going to be something and we got to start putting that.

Business systems in place and getting things in order so that we can duplicate and scale what it is we do for multiple players, as opposed to just ad hoc, kind of helping one or two players. When, when in the process did that take place. And then I guess the next step goes to what you just said about the longterm vision.

When did that come into view, as you started to put together your, your, your business plan?

Brandon Goble: [00:19:39] You know, it was probably, you know, within, within that first year, we kind of had a sense that, you know, there was probably something there which there was a lot of help from him. To be able to give us some context and perspective of what the space looked like before we showed up.

Cause I just, I didn’t know anything about it. Right. It was interacting with the basketball [00:20:00] community from a business standpoint. Like I didn’t, I didn’t know who the other players were as far as the businesses. I didn’t know what their models look like or anything like that. So, so Dan was able to give me some, you know, advice and perspective on kind of what the quote game looks like.

And that’s when I really started sitting down and said, okay, well, how can I break it? Like, I’m going to break it and then I’m going to put it back the way that I want it. Right. Okay. W what is the business model look like? Typically, whether it’s events or scouting or whatever. I’m gonna take that. I’m going to snap it in half, and then we’re gonna put this thing back together.

The way that I think makes sense for a longer term, more sustainable business plan. But also just from how can I utilize this to help as many people as humanly possible. And so, so we really, we jumped into that right away. You know, Matthew Clark is, is one of our, is our software engineer. And and so we built this thing.

We built Juco advocate.com which we figured out real [00:21:00] quick was not necessarily the way to do this. So we spent a lot of time and energy, you know, building something that we threw away. Relatively quickly. But it, it was a good learning process for us too. You know, as far as figuring out like the best way to access players, the best way to disseminate information because what we built just like really didn’t work, right.

It just, it just didn’t make sense because garbage in garbage out and you know, the technology was, was great, but it just didn’t work. And even now I see a lot of these businesses that pop up and disappear spending a ton of money you know, they get angel investors and they get all these different things and they, they build these things and it’s like, nobody’s going to use that, you know, or, or if they do use it, it’s, you know, going to be this incredibly like niche market kind of thing.

And so, you know, we get pitched on a lot of those things too, every couple of weeks, like, you know, somebody wants to talk about their business and their technology platform and stuff. And you know, we’re fortunate that we’ve already been through it. And kind of seeing what that looks like. And [00:22:00] so, you know, early on, we kind of figured.

All right. Well, we’ve got, we’re going to have, we’re going to have a lot of things and the fire. This is going to be more than just a tech business. This is going to be more than just a website. And, and it took some time to really kind of figure out What we wanted to do from a technology standpoint.

And it just so happened that, you know, as I’m, as I’m working on things and I’m, I’m working on different projects and I’m constantly using verbal commits and I’m going, you know, like I need to get with Nathan, like we gotta see about working together on this, because I think if I take, you know, what we do with Matt and in this, you know, his software know-how and all that sort of thing.

And, and we put it together with Nathan and what, you know, this incredible thing that he’s built over the last nine years. Like we can probably do some really dope stuff. And so, you know, we’re not quite there yet on the tech side of it, it’s it’s underway. So people are gonna see some super cool stuff coming out soon.

That’s, you know, for us, we think is going to be a game changer [00:23:00] just not just for us, but in the, in the basketball space. And it’s really gonna be kind of like our, our home base for all the other things we do. And the funny thing about social media, you know, we talked about like brand growth and all that sort of thing, but social media has also been kind of the thing that has connected me to all the other spaces that I didn’t know I would ever be working in.

Like the international side of stuff that we do a ton of. And even then, you know, some of this domestic camp things that we work with Dan on, they’re in Chicago, and we’re gonna expand that you know, doing these inner city free camps for kids and, and all that sort of thing. And, and I look back on it and I go, geez, all that came from Twitter.

Yeah. Which has mattered.

Mike Klinzing: [00:23:39] It really is. I mean, it’s just as amazing how interconnected it is. I mean, the basketball world in and of itself, as I’m sure you know, is very, very small and you’re one or two people away from being connected to just about anybody at any level of the game, but then you take it and social media is such a multiplier of that when you, especially when [00:24:00] you start talking about.

The business side of it and being able to connect with people who do interesting things on the business. End of it. When you start thinking about the technology, you’re talking about it, I don’t know how much you want to talk about what’s coming and what’s not, you know, what, what you have coming down the line.

But when you start talking about the tech side of it, how do you go about what’s the process for trying to build something that you know, is going to a, do what you needed to do? And two is going to be something that, you know, you mentioned that you saw businesses pop up where you’re like, oh yeah, nobody’s ever going to use that.

So how did you envision what you guys want to do so that you make sure that people are going to want to use it and that it’s going to serve the needs that you needed to serve?

Brandon Goble: [00:24:48]  Well, I mean, a big piece of it was trying to really wrap our arms around really as much of the community as possible. [00:25:00] As opposed to just talking about, you know, the, the guys that are going to the NBA just focusing on the recruitment of the highest of high major guys and all that.

It was more, you know, yeah, there there’s super cool stories and, and lots of information and people want to read about you know, these top level guys, but we were, we were having such a great experience, like being a part of the lives of kids that were going in AI or D two or D three or junior college, or, you know, whatever.

And, and so we kind of found that not very many people were doing that and if they were, they weren’t doing it very efficiently. They weren’t, you know, garnering all that information. They weren’t telling those stories. They weren’t drawing a lot of attention and exposure to those kids. And when we started doing.

That’s when everything really took off, you know, like if I, if I jumped on there and I started talking about the, you know, the kid that duke just signed, I’m kind of irrelevant. [00:26:00] Right. I mean, I may have an opinion that knows that kid. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I may have an opinion that’s like super smart and different than everybody else, but nobody cares.

Right. But when I get on there and talk about, you know, the path of Solomon Heinen and how he was a combat veteran and went to middle of nowhere, junior college and, you know, dealt with a lot of like personal shit, just like trying to really kind of come out of that world and into this, you know, Juco world.

I mean, imagine coming from, you know, the, the most like structured environment ever, right. And spending time in Iraq and Afghanistan and things like that. And then winding up at Midland junior college to play college basketball. And he’s not played basketball since his junior year of high school. And, and like how crazy that is.

And then being able to tell that story and everybody’s like, Hey, this is awesome. What else do you got? It’s like, oh, okay. Here’s this other thing. And that’s really kind of been the driver for a lot of the decisions that we make as far as like the things that we should go do. So, [00:27:00] you know, when we go to Africa, like, you know, we’re running free camps over there and stuff, like if we happen to find, you know, you know, high, major caliber players, which we’ve done that’s awesome.

And we’ll tell those stories and, and, you know, people are super interested in hearing about them and stuff, but if those same stories actually ended up being in AI caliber players, which there have often also been those stories are just as interesting. And, and so, you know, we really kind of have always just put our emphasis on like, it’s less about the talent level and it’s more about the background and the story and the opportunity.

And that’s, that’s just kind of how we’ve always driven our business is, is what decisions do we make? That allow us to tell those stories, find those kids, help those kids and then, you know, send them on their way and then let them start telling their own story.

Mike Klinzing: [00:27:52] All right. So that goes

to something that you’ve mentioned twice.  Now, when you talk about the international camps and running [00:28:00] those in other countries and other places in the world, and you also talked about doing free inner city camps. So what I get from that is that there’s a mission behind what you guys are doing in terms of using basketball, to be able to have an impact on those kids’ lives that you’re touching to the camps.

So tell me a little bit about the why behind that. Why is that so important to you? What’s the Genesis of that piece of it being a part of your business and what you hope to accomplish moving forward in terms of growth in that particular area?

Brandon Goble: [00:28:39] You know, basketball is, is this interesting vehicle? It’s, it’s the second, most popular sport in the world.

It’s the fastest growing sport in the world. And so, you know, we know that if we go out in the world, regardless of where we’re going we’re going to find people playing basketball and we’re pretty good at watching people play basketball [00:29:00] and then getting them college scholarships. So, you know, as I was, is I was still working in the corporate world up until a couple of years ago while I was, you know, doing this on the side.

I would literally lay there at night and think about like, alright, when I’m, when I’m old and retired and I look back and I think, okay, well, what did you accomplish in your life? You know, outside of your family? I’ve got two wonderful kids and a wonderful wife, but outside of that, What have you accomplished?

And I, and I would have these panic attacks where I’d be like, holy crap, I’m going to like talk about how many files I, you know, completed in, in this thing. And I got promoted to VP of whatever. And, and, and I would, I would literally like have these panic attacks thinking like, oh my God, I’m going to have done nothing.

And, and fortunately for me where are we at now? About four years ago. So I, you know, we were just kind of getting going a guy named Matthew McAllister reached out to me [00:30:00] who’s a high school coach up in Minnesota. He’s a heck of a basketball coach and he hit me on Twitter and he said, Hey I’m the, I’m the national team coach for Tanzania.

Which means I go over there and try and get kids to play basketball because by national team, like we haven’t played in a major tournament like ever in Tanzania. So we’re really taking a grassroots approach to this. And I was wondering if you want. And I’m like, yeah, strange dude from the internet that I’ve never met before ever even heard of.

Let’s definitely go 10,000 miles from here to, in an east African country and and do basketball stuff. And, and so it was funny like at the time I’m like, yeah, no, sure. It’s like, when you’re drinking with your buddies in college and you’re like, let’s go to Europe and they’re like, yeah. And then the next day you just, you know, you go about your life.

That was, that was totally like the conversation with Matt where I’m like, yeah, let’s do it. Alright, man. See ya in the next DM. And he just like, kept hitting me about it. And he’s like, Hey, I’m going in like six months. I’m going in [00:31:00] like four months, I’m going in three months. I’m like, all right, like maybe we should go do this.

So I got ahold of Dan. And then our buddy Shea Frazy who’s a trainer. And and I said, Hey, I got this guy that I’ve never met before. And I haven’t even yet talked to on the phone. So that’s good. And he wants us to go to Africa with them and they’re, they’re just as dumb. And they’re like, yeah, let’s do it.

And and so we get on the horn with Matt and he’s like, yeah, this is, you know, this is what you need to do and, you know, allow I’ll already be. Yeah. So I’ll meet you guys there. And you know, so we all went and got our, you know, 23 different shots that you need to go over there. And and we jumped on it.

And so the first time I ever met Matt McAllister was in Daraa Salaam, Tanzania. Fortunately he showed up at the airport to get us and, and it didn’t catfishes. And so we get off, we get off this plane and, and, you know, it’s, I mean, none of us had ever been [00:32:00] to Africa. And even though I traveled around the world, when I was a kid, I had really, hadn’t done crap since I’d moved back to the states.

And and, and, you know, I think Dan had traveled some shade, traveled a little bit, but none of us had ever been to Africa. None of us were really fully prepared for what was about to happen. And and so we, we go and we, we go to this hotel that’s in downtown Dar and, and, you know, as soon as you’re, as soon as you’re driving, you know, to this hotel, You’re just like, wide-eyed right.

It’s just a normal African city, but for us, it was like we were on the moon. And, and so we’re just, you know, we’re just staring at everything, like wondering what the heck is going on. And and so we get to this airport and they drop us off or get to this hotel and they drop us off and they’re like, okay, you know, we’ll, we’ll see you at 8:00 AM tomorrow to run this camp, which, you know, at the time we didn’t know what 8:00 AM meant over there.

So that’s, I’ll tell that in a minute. But so that night we kind of like, okay, you know, the facility that we’re going to use is over, there we go over. There’s a couple of kids [00:33:00] playing it just hotter than all blazes. Cause I mean, Dar is like basically on the equator and you know, we’re like, this is amazing.

This is cool, you know, whatever. And we go up and we, we have a beer up on the roof of the hotel and we’re looking over this, the city. And then we realized like, we’re on it. We’re, we’re in a different spot because as it gets dark and the sun goes down and it gets night, like there’s no light. Right. I mean the power super inconsistent around there.

And we’re like, well, this is different. And and so we get up that next morning and then we found out what, what Africa time is and Africa time is if they say, we’ll see you at 8:00 AM and come pick you up to take you probably at about nine 30. Pretty good. And so we’re standing hang out on the street corner at this hotel, like just kind of waiting and there’s, you know, people pushing all these carts by, and, and this, this big old truck goes ripping by with, with a bunch of guys carrying a case.

Like the whole back of this truck is just full of guys hanging off of it. Karen AKs. And I’m like, Hey, Dan, we’re not in, we’re not in the us anymore, man. And we show up [00:34:00] up and there’s 200 kids at this time. And it’s Matt, our boy Behati who runs a facility over there who is an amazing human being and in a super close friend to these days, to this day.

And then me Dan and Shay and Shay is, you know, he’s a trainer. Like he can run these camps, he can put kids through the drills and stuff. Dan and I are observers. We’re not, we’re not camper unders, right? Like as far as, as far as putting the ball on the deck. Right. And so we got 200 kids there and Matt and Behati and Shea are running 200 kids through these drills.

And Dan and I are looking at each other, like, I don’t even know what’s happening right now. What are we supposed to do? You know and of course, nobody really knows how to play basketball in this thing. And, and that was when we really kind of just start to figure out though that like, that doesn’t matter. You know, especially when you scout over there and you recruit over there and things it’s different. Like you have to just be prepared to look at things with [00:35:00] a different eye.

It’s, it’s like a, it’s like an artist, I guess, is like the only thing I can say, like some people see different things in art, right. So when I watch players, especially when I’m in those kinds of environments, like I’m looking for different things. I don’t really care how good you are at playing basketball, because I have to assume that you’re just, you’re just not anywhere close to be being as capable at that moment.

As somebody I’m going to go see in the U S but I’m looking for potential and I’m looking for ability to grow and I’m looking at those kids, like they’re a lump of clay. And I think, man, what if a coach that like, this kid has no bad habits, cause he has no habits. And you know, a coach gets that for the first time and like, what are they going to be able to do with that?

And, and so. Seeing that and thinking like, you know what, like this is probably not a bad idea. I think there’s a lot of kids here that we can help and then really getting to spend a lot of time with those kids too, and, you know, going to their homes and meeting them and meeting their parents and, you [00:36:00] know, hearing about like what their dreams are and different things like that.

And you know, we were able to help five kids from that camp. You know, five kids had played college basketball and, or, or about to play college basketball from that camp, couple of them were war refugees from Congo that were, were kind of refugees in the city there. And, and so you get to spend time getting to know these kids and everything and, and look, most of those kids at the camp knew that like, Hey, I’m not playing college basketball.

They were just happy to be there. And we were happy that they were there and we got to spend time with them and get to know them and stuff. But you know, we met kids like a Tiki Elliot TKI. Who’s, who’s going to BYU next year and he’d never really played organized basketball. And by not really ever played, like definitely had never played organized basketball before.

But you know, you saw something in him and you talk to him and you spend time with them and, and things like that. And you kind of think like, man, I there’s something in this kid that’s just different right now. It helps that he’s tall. It wasn’t that tall back then he was about six, eight. And you know, there’s something in there and I think he’s going to work [00:37:00] hard and I think he’ll just listen and he’ll absorb things and, you know, cause he spend a week doing stuff and when you teach him something and he repeats it right away, you’re like, all right, you know, there’s something in there.

And you know, now a Tiki is, you know, flourishing and, and you know, was recruited by Oklahoma and West Virginia and San Diego state and, and ended up choosing BYU which is crazy. Think back to like when we were there and I tease him all the time, I’ll send him pictures of him when he was, you know, about 175 pounds soaking wet.

He’s about 2 30, 2 now. And and I’m like, Hey, you know, you remember what you remember what this guy, you know, look like. He’s like, Hey. And I’m like, all right, well, remember when you came over, cause he went to Canada, we set him up with Angela Provenzano at London basketball academy. I said, remember when you showed up in Canada, like you had to promise this guy in the picture that you were going to work hard and you did and look where you are now, but that doesn’t stop.

You know, when you get to Provo [00:38:00] here in about two or three weeks, like you still owed that promise to this kid, right? Because you got all those other kids, there were 200 kids in that camp at Tiki and you were one of 200 that got this opportunity. You owe all of those kids. Cause they’re all white. And he gets it.

And you know, a lot of those kids that we deal with now in those things, I have the same conversation with all of them. It’s like, Hey, I wish I could find schools for all 200 kids. I can’t, it’s just not a reality. So if you get this opportunity every time you, you know, make a choice that doesn’t lead to your own personal success, it doesn’t matter if you’re a great basketball player.

It’s more about being a good human, a good student, a good citizen, all that sort of stuff. And the basketball part will come. But every time you make a choice, that is not, you know, trying to be the best you that you can be. You’re letting all those guys down because they didn’t get that opportunity. [00:39:00] And so we spend a lot of time like having those conversations with these kids where, you know, say, Hey, I, I can, for some reason I’m able to help you do.

This thing, like better than almost anybody. I know enough people, I have enough connections. People trust me, I get it right more often than not. So fortunately they’ll listen, like I can get you this opportunity, but this is on you to actually succeed. I just had a conversation with a kid today that’s from Ireland where I had that same conversation.

Like, Hey, you know how many kids in Ireland would love to be here and have this opportunity that you have, like, this choice is yours. Like, you know, you’re talented enough that the choice is yours for how good you’re going to be, how far you’re going to go. And again, I don’t care if you wind up at Kansas or Kentucky Wesleyan, like it doesn’t matter.

It’s, it’s all the other stuff. And if you get your education and you’re successful in the classroom and you’re successful human being and, and you get your degree, like we won. And so that really, that first [00:40:00] trip with Matt McAllister and meeting a TKI and, and getting those kids over here was like, all right, well, this is what you’re going to do for the rest of your life.

And, and then I don’t wake up having panic attacks anymore.

Mike Klinzing: [00:40:13] Clearly a good thing. I would think that just to go along with what you were talking about, that those kids that you bring over, not only are they representing the kids that attended that camp with them, they’re also in a way they’re also advocates for the next generation of kids who are going to come up behind them, where you say, okay, this kid came over, had success with it.

That’s on the basketball floor of the classroom in their life. And now the next coach is that much more willing to take a chance on somebody who attended the camp or was recommended by you guys, whatever the case may be. And it’s just to be able to have. That impact where again, it’s not just the impact on one kid, which is clearly important, but you can also impact [00:41:00] that next generation by continuing to open doors, to a place that those kids may not have had access to previously.

And to me, I could see where the reward in that for you guys and what you’re doing as part of your business can be just again astronomical. And when I think back to what you said about your tenure plan and wanting to have an impact on, you know, on the world, it’s one thing to be able to, to bring kids, to play college basketball, and have an impact amount of on them in that way and on their coaching staffs on the programs that they come to.

But ultimately if you could have a positive influence on that kid in their life, and then that translates to the other kids who are around them and opens up more doors. For people who may not have had opportunities previously, I can see where the reward in that it goes well beyond anything that you can measure in your bank account.

Brandon Goble: [00:41:49] For sure. And, and we’ve been, we’ve been so incredibly fortunate to you know, meet the right kids early and then, you know, have [00:42:00] fortunately been able to continue to meet the right kids. And I don’t know if that’s Lucker divine intervention or what, but, you know, meeting a TKI and little Jerry  who’s down at Mexico military and in quarterly on Sue’s girl that, that plays over here now.

But then even like Gideon George, who you know, who also plays at BYU, but he was from the Nigeria camp and his story has kind of blown up and gone everywhere. Cause they, they showed they did a little doc thing on it that played on CBS during the NCAA tournament. And, you know, Gideon is the world’s greatest human being.

Like he’s, he’s just one of those kids where you’re like, holy cow, if you had a whole team of these kids, like you’ll just win as many national championships as you want. Because he works so hard and he’s, he’s so smart and you know, just absolutely loving and caring and, you know, wants to have a greater impact on this planet than just basketball while also being an unbelievable basketball player.

I mean, [00:43:00] again, another kid that had hardly played any organized basketball and comes to the Nigeria camp rides a 14, 15 hour bus ride from Mina. However far it was. You know, sleeping outside the walls and the cops are chasing them. Cause there was this whole crazy thing where one of the, the facility directors was taking the kids money and charging them to play in the thing, even though we don’t, you know, we don’t charge kids.

And so they, but the kids are so respectful and so gracious that, that they didn’t say anything, but they had nowhere to stay and they didn’t have anything to eat. And you know, this camp’s like five days. And so, you know, kids kind of started looking a little tired or whatever, and we’re like, what the heck is going on?

And finally, somebody else, one of the other people that worked at the facility told us what had happened. None of the kids ever said a word. And so we had this, I dunno, I kind of lost my mind. And got into a shouting match in a foreign country in a far flung off city with somebody. And

[00:44:00] Mike Klinzing: [00:44:00] hopefully the AK47’s weren’t around at that point.

Brandon Goble: [00:44:02] No, they were. And fortunately a couple of them were on our side and you know, we, we, we, you know, higher security now when we go into these things. And so fortunately that, that whole thing was nuts. If there was a video camera there, that thing would have gone viral, but anyways, we got it all figured out and, and you know, so Gideon comes to New Mexico junior college and wins freshmen of the year in the wagon.

Which is bonkers. I mean, it’s, you know, arguably the most difficult league in all of junior college, it’s like high major junior college basketball and, and he just starts dominating just by sheer effort. He still didn’t have any idea what he was doing. And so he, you know, continues to play and he’s a, he’s an Ali guy and, and and then goes to BYU and halfway through the season.

Now he’s a starting three man, you know, for a top 25 Mark Pope BYU team and go see NCAA tournament. And it’s like, it’s just bonkers, like to see that. And then, you know, one of the things he focuses on is sending shoes home. He’s probably sent a [00:45:00] few thousand pairs of shoes back to Nigeria now. And and, and now with the help of BYU, especially this season, he’s going to be able to do 10 times that I’ll bet.

I’ll bet. This season he’ll end up sending 20, 30,000 pairs of shoes back tonight. And so he’s utilizing his platform to help people back home with something super specific because the highest transmission of disease in Africa comes through their feet because they don’t have, they don’t have good shoes.

And so it’s not really just like a basketball thing. It’s like, you know, just having any kind of shoes thing. And so now kids are tweeting pictures of their new shoes and, you know, they’re thanking Gideon on, on the internet and, and all this sort of stuff. And it’s just crazy to think about like him taking advantage of that opportunity, not only to better himself and his family and all that sort of thing, but then help all these thousands of kids back home and to, to take, take this platform and just really run with it.

And, and, you know, so for us, we’ve been so [00:46:00] fortunate that we got to meet somebody like Gideon because Gideon allows us to help the next kid. Right, because now everybody’s saying like, oh, you know, you know, I would love to have a Gideon on my team. It’s like, cool, we’re going to go try and find as many Gideons as we can.

Now. They may not all be as good as basketball players as Gideon. And we hope that they’re as good at human beings as Gideon, but we’re gonna. And you know, people have been accepting of that where it’s like, you know, it is, it’s a little weird, it’s a little tough for some of them now to say, okay, I’m just going to sign this player sight unseen.

You’re sending me some bouncing grainy video from a broken court and in, in, you know, a foreign country and I’m like, yep, here we go. Yeah, that’s what we, that’s what we got. So, you know, we, we go down to the Caribbean Tyrique, sing JP a couple of kids that came over and are being super successful now.

And, and so we get to tell those stories and we get to, you know, have these, these lifelong relationships with some [00:47:00] of these kids now. And it’s, it’s just such an amazing thing because like their effort and success leads to just so many more opportunities for other kids, not even necessarily in their own country.

Right. I mean, they’re just by them being them, they’re helping kids completely, you know, passively they, they don’t even understand that they’re. Other kids.

Mike Klinzing: [00:47:23] So what does the relationship look like? Long-term obviously you’re staying in touch with your guys that you bring over and that you help them to find the right place to play the right school for them the right level.

But as you move, as you move forward and they, they continue to go and they grow in their college career and then eventually they graduate. What do you anticipate the relationship being like between you and those players that you’ve been able to help? And what does that look like on your end of it?

Brandon Goble: [00:47:53] It’s, it’s such a weird thing because it’s not something I ever expected to where you have these [00:48:00] relationships, even if it’s just a phone call periodically or whatever, like they’re relationships you’re going to have for life.

Because you’re kind of like, you’re a little bit like family now where, you know, you’ve helped them with something, but in turn, they’ve helped you. You know, they’ve helped me just personally is as far as growing as a person finding purpose things like that. And so you have like this, this extra special relationship that you don’t typically have with, you know, just your normal friends or things like that.

And so, I mean, when I’m, when I’m 60 years old, I’m probably gonna spend five days out of the week, just, you know, making phone calls to people that I know that I enjoy talking to and finding out what they’re, what they’re doing. You know, there’s, now that we’ve been kind of doing this for what five years the first crop of kids that are kind of done playing basketball butter, having kids of their own, or you know, [00:49:00] getting master’s degrees or starting their first jobs are still playing professional basketball or something.

Like, you know, we talked to those guys And, and it doesn’t have anything to do with business. And, and that’s honestly, probably the most rewarding part of the entire job is, you know, being able to help tell those stories, putting them on a path for them to start writing their own story and then getting to continue to kind of just hear it straight from them later on.

Mike Klinzing: [00:49:26] Absolutely. I think when I think about some of the conversations that we’ve had with coaches here on the podcast, and so many of them talk about what you just said, which is they love coaching the players in the moment. They love the thrill of victory, the X’s, and O’s all that stuff. But ultimately it’s those relationships that they’ve built with their players, where 10 years down the road, 20 years down the road, when there’s a new job, when there’s a marriage, when there’s a birth of a child, and there’s some other big life event that they’re being dealt in on that with those players that they impacted [00:50:00] and how gratifying.

That can be how gratifying those phone calls are. Those visits are, or those invitations are that you get after the fact that not when you’re in the heat of the moment, but long after you realized the kind of impact that you had as a coach or a business owner or a teacher or whatever, it may be. That to me, there’s nothing more valuable in that we’ve had so many coaches that have shared a similar sentiment.

And it’s interesting to hear you say that you didn’t necessarily expect that, but again, I think anytime you’re having as great of an impact as what you’re able to do, I mean, you’re essentially changing, especially someone from a foreign country. I mean, you’re essentially changing their life trajectory in a way that is immeasurable.

So it makes sense that those people want to stay in touch with someone or somebody that has had that kind of impact on them. And it speaks to the mission of what you talked about right off the top. [00:51:00] Hey, we have these things that we’re doing in foreign countries. We’re doing them in the inner city. We want to be able to have an impact beyond basketball.

And really when you think about it, the game, I forget now who said this to us, but said something to the effect of what a privilege it is to be able to use something that we love the game of basketball, to be able to have an impact on people. And to me, that’s really, that’s really what it’s all about. I want to ask you a little bit about some of the things that you guys do at ju Juco advocate here, sort of on a, more on a more business side of it, where you talk about there’s three different sort of arms that you guys try to impact.

So you’re talking with players, there are services you provide for players, there’s services, you provide for the junior college coaches, and then you have some services that you provide for NCAA or any coaches. So just talk maybe a little bit about each one of those. [00:52:00] Separate services, what you do, how you do it and just explain that part of the business model.

Yeah.

Brandon Goble: [00:52:06] We’ve got the scouting stuff that we do. We, we make a ton of video stuff for kids, which has nothing to do with really making money, but it, but it kind of leads into some along all of the scouting stuff that we work on. We’ve got the some of the event, things that we do, you know, we’ve, we’ve got our undiscovered brand that.

We work on with some other folks and that’s kind of the inner city camp side of things that we’re going to continue to expand where the plan is to continue to work with NBA players sponsoring those things so that those kids camps, you know, it’s easy to maintain those as free camps for kids because we do have a 5 0 1 C3, the advocate foundation that we also operate that we’re able to do a lot of these things through.

And we do have like RJ 48 camp, which is kind of like a McDonald’s All-American of junior college which just kind of started out as like this, you know, like, Hey, you know what, nobody’s doing this thing, [00:53:00] like, let’s go do it. It’ll be cool. And fortunately, everybody got behind it and it kind of blew up and, and I’m super excited to get to run that again after missing last year with COVID, but we’ll be running that again here in July, down in Florida.

And. So we’ve, you know, we’ve got that stuff the website sort of thing you know, as far as advertising and all that sort of stuff goes and we’ve got, we’ve got some changes coming. So we’ve kind of established ourself in a lot of ways with different ways that we can make money and, and continue to grow the business.

And now we’re sitting down and looking at it and saying, all right, let’s break it. And we’re going to put it back together in a different way. And so we have some approaches that we’re going to be taking from sponsorship side of things, some media sort of things some NISL stuff as that becomes more readily available down the pike here soon for different re revenue models for us, where we’re finding more ways to make even more stuff [00:54:00] free for everybody while also growing the business and growing our revenue stream.

And so that’s really always kind of been our thing is like, all right, well, now that this is established, how can we break it and put it back together in a way that allows us to grow even bigger and faster while helping more people and making things cost even less for everybody. Which I know is a super weird way to approach this stuff, but I mean, that’s just what we do.

Mike Klinzing: [00:54:28] I think it’s  interesting because when you start talking about the business side of it, most people, if something is working and take that, however you want in terms of what that actually means, but when you start talking about taking something that is relatively successful and is working, and then you’re going to break it and you’re going to go back and try to put it together in a different way.

Is that a mindset that you sort of always had, or was that something that you kind of had to teach [00:55:00] yourself as part of the. This process of building a business?

Brandon Goble: [00:55:04] I think it was, it was beneficial for me to come in pretty fresh into the business and be able to just sit back and look at how everybody else was doing it.

And then say, well, I don’t think that’s the most efficient way to do something. And so it, if I, if I would have probably grown up in, in basketball and you know, spent all my summers playing in AAU events and things like that, I probably, would’ve just kind of been indoctrinated to this is how it is.

And, and I think fortunately for me, in, in how we approach business, I didn’t have. And so, you know, I could look at things and say, well, I think I can do this different, or I can do this better, or I can do this more efficiently or cheaper or I can help more people doing this, this thing the other way.

And so, you know, we’re looking at it, lots of different things, you know, the media side of it, we’re looking at fashion stuff like personal branding for players through [00:56:00] NISL and, and allowing them to create their own fashion lines and use, you know, our platform, this massive platform that we have to you know, for them to take care of themselves with that.

And for us, then that becomes another revenue driver and, you know, different things where I’ve always kind of taken the stance that if people like to support cool stuff, and if you’re doing lots of cool stuff and you become poppy. And people want to see you do more cool stuff and they keep following it.

People with a lot of money will throw that money at cool stuff. And so I’m always looking from the standpoint of like, what’s super cool that I can go do that is going to get enough attention and have enough of an impact that when I walk into a room with somebody that has a lot of money and I say, look at all this cool stuff, wouldn’t you like to be a part of it?

They say yes. And so [00:57:00] that’s, that’s kind of the approach that we’re taking here. And everybody will kind of see how that develops over the next year here, where we’ve got all this cool stuff that we’ve been doing. We’ve got super cool stuff that nobody knows about yet that we’re going to be. And we’ve got some people that are looking at our cool stuff going like, yeah, I think I want to be a part of that.

And, and that’s exciting for me because, you know, every time I get somebody on board with supporting what we do financially, then I’m able to say, okay, this other revenue thing over here, we’re going to keep doing it, but now it’s not going to drive revenue. It’s going to be free. And that’s like a really backwards way of making money.

But I think we’re figuring it out. So yeah, we’re, we’re trying to do cool stuff and, and get people excited about it. And and then a few of those specific people have a bunch of money and they, they want to be a part of it and the best they can be a part of it is with a check. Well, and it also,

Mike Klinzing: [00:57:56] From your perspective, it also [00:58:00] allows you to continuously reinvent what you’re doing and also challenges you in different ways in terms of.

Okay. I I’m sure that when you started with this thing, you know, you mentioned fashion, I’m sure that at no point when you first, you know, when you’re sitting down in the coach’s office, sharing analytics, you’re not thinking about, Hey, we may eventually want to build some fashion brands alongside what it is that we do.

It’s just, but, but yet in the course of doing it now, suddenly you’re involved, you’re involved in something that you never would’ve thought you were going to be involved in. And I know that one of the things that I enjoy doing is being able to figure out and try to put your, put your hand into different pots.

I probably do that to my own detriment, to some degree where you’re just, I want to be able to learn more. I always tell people there’s, there’s so many interesting things going on in the world. There’s just, there just isn’t enough time. In the day when I hear somebody say on [00:59:00] board, I’m like, there’s like, there’s like a million things that I’d want to learn more about or do or figure out.

And I just don’t have, I just don’t have the time during the day. So it sounds like from the conversation that you and I have had that in that way, I think you and I have some similarities that you are constantly looking for. Interesting things to work on and interesting people to be able to connect with and in having done so throughout the course of your life, it’s enabled you to build Juco advocate into what it is today and that it’s going to continue to evolve because you’re constantly on the lookout for these new opportunities, that kind of an accurate description of where you’re at and what you’ve done so far.

Brandon Goble: [00:59:37] Yeah, for sure. And I, and that’s really what kind of drove Nathan and I together was we were looking at each other’s stuff and seeing that there was, you know, we’re, we’re two very different things. In regards to our personalities and, and things like that, but what we’re interested in and, you know, the idea that we want to have a greater impact on, on not just the basketball community, [01:00:00] but on the world and want to do that in such a way that is super different than, you know, anybody’s really tried to do it before.

Like that’s exactly the same mindset that we, we both have, it literally took us one conversation and be like, Hey, I think we should do stuff together. And so, you know, as, as we’ve gone through this process, we’ve just kinda been sitting in the background here, like innovating and, and, and building things and, and kind of just getting ready to push go.

And that’s what I’m super pumped about coming into the fall and winter of this year. And then especially into the spring of next year when all these things are kind of spun up and ready to go, if people kind of get to see what we’ve been working on for two weeks, Yeah, I got it from a technology.

Yeah. I mean, not only from a technology space, but I mean, we’ve got, you know, some, we’ve got some stuff that’s going to be ready to go. And, and it’s, you know, it’s all kind of, kind of just happen at once. And I think I’m mentally and emotionally ready for it, I [01:01:00] think.

But you know, we’ll, we’ll figure it out as we go…

Mike Klinzing: [01:01:04] That sounds like a return appearance on the Hoop Heads Pod.

Brandon Goble: [01:01:05] Yeah, maybe it’s yeah, so I’m, I’m really excited about it and what I’m just extra excited about it with is like, you know, we see the future of where we’re headed with this. You know, not only from a business business growth standpoint, but then Nathan and I can sit down and really look at it and say, holy cow, like, you know how many kids we’re going to be able to help with this and what we’re doing.

And, and really kind of hopefully change the way a lot of things are done in this space and like that. Super exciting for us.

Mike Klinzing: [01:01:37] All right. Give me the 32nd current elevator pitch for what JUCO Advocate does is when you meet somebody and they ask you, Hey, what do you do? Give me the 30 second elevator pitch that you’re going with right now in the moment.

And then I’m sure it’s going to change based on what you’ve just said, but just tell us what that is right now. When you sit down with an investor or just somebody [01:02:00] asks you,

Brandon Goble: [01:02:01] I mean, basketball is for everybody, right? I mean, there’s, there’s, there’s nobody that can’t be a part of basketball if they want to be.

So our company goes out and makes sure that everybody that wants to be a part of basketball can at least be a small part of. And so that’s, that’s where we, that’s what we spend all our time doing is going around the world and, and going all over the country here and spending time on the phone and you know, working in a technology space to make sure that if you want to be a part of basketball, even if it’s a very small part, you can be a part of basketball because basketball is literally for everybody it’s for people like me that never played basketball before.

It’s people like Nathan, that is more on the tech side of it. It’s for people that like Tiki and Gideon that are, you know, maybe future NBA prospects, like it’s for everyone. And so we want to make sure that everybody has that opportunity

Mike Klinzing: [01:02:56] Makes sense. Great answer. I think it clearly [01:03:00] states what it is that you guys do and the impact that you want to have.

I want to wrap up by asking you one final crush question, Brandon, and that is when you think about how important it is to build a network of people. We talked about it earlier, how interconnected the basketball. World is, and I’m sure you could speak to the interconnectedness of the business and technology side of this thing too.

But if you were going to give someone advice about building their network, I think about you building trust with coaches so that they know that when you come to them with a player that what you say they’re going to get is 99.9% of the time going to be what they actually get. How do you build those genuine relationships?

That genuine network connection, because we know that in the coaching profession, which a lot of our audience is made up of coaches that having a genuine relationship with somebody can lead you to your next job can [01:04:00] lead you to your next opportunity. And yet you don’t want to seem like you’re always just asking for things and having somebody to go to them and say, Hey, can you give me the next job, but building an actual, honest relationship with them.

What advice would you have for coaches out there in terms of. Building relationships with other people in the basketball business.

Brandon Goble: [01:04:23] I think brutal honesty is where it starts. And you, and you just can’t be intimidated now. It’s definitely a little different for me than it is for a coach.

In, in some ways I think what, I think what some of these people appreciate. Most from me is that, that I’m just always as candid as possible and as honest as possible with them, because otherwise, if I’m BS in somebody on something, it’s going to come back and bite me in the ass and it’s going to harm the relationship and whatever.

And there’s plenty of guys that I have just a very like business relationship with, right? Like our interaction [01:05:00] is, you know, tell me about this player. I tell them about the player and then, you know, we move on and that’s fine. There’s nothing wrong with that. But there are so many relationships that have been built over having those discussions and then just being genuinely honest with them about what I’m interested in, why I do what I do what really strikes me about, you know, maybe this player or that player, and it maybe doesn’t have anything to do with their jump shot.

Right. I’m like, Hey, get on the phone with this kid. And like, you know, ask him about his, his life story to, you know, talk to him about his mom, like, you know, whatever. And then they go, you know, Jesus ready? Like, I love this kid, you know, I don’t know where he fits on the team and maybe I’m not even going to recruit him, but like, like, okay, you kind of, you kind of see things from a different perspective.

And I think, I think if you’re just genuinely honest and really also just expose who you are, the ones that you want to work with and the ones that you want to work for, you know, if that’s why you’re really networking is to kind of establish those additional connections for like job stuff later on.

They’re [01:06:00] going to appreciate that. The ones you don’t really want to work with and don’t want to work for, then they’re just not going to get it. And that’s fine. Like you don’t, you don’t need to worry about the number of connections you have. You need to worry about the number of connections you have that actually matter.

I’ve got probably 5,500 coaches cell phone numbers in my phone, and I don’t have a genuine strong relationship with 5,500 people. The ones that are important and matter. That’s fine. The ones that are just kind of casual and cursory and whatever, like that’s fine too. You know, everybody has those relationships, but I put myself out there.

I mean, you even see on like, you know, on, on the Twitter account on Juco advocate, like verbal commits is very just database you know, information. But over time, like the Juco advocate account has really been just more of a reflection of me. And, you know, I, I’m not afraid to say stuff. I’m not afraid to call things out.

We do have some [01:07:00] additional things like project rise that we do that are social justice based as far as getting more black coaches into division one basketball. And I don’t mind like saying that stuff on the internet and if people have a problem with it, that’s fine. I probably didn’t want to work with you anyways.

So, you know, I put myself out there and just really focus on those relationships that matter most. And that’s my network. And you’ll find like pretty quick that like-minded people. Group together in this business, we’re a little clicky, right? Some of the people that are my best friends in this business are also best friends with other people that are some of my best friends.

And that’s just the way that works out. And, you know, if there’s somebody that just wants it to be a strict business relationship, that’s perfectly fine. Like I have no issue with that whatsoever because this is a business and they’re trying to do their business the best way that they know how, and I’m trying to help kids.

And if that means that my business relationship with this person helps a kid, when that perfect, done that transaction is complete. You. I say, look at [01:08:00] this kid, he looks at the kid, the kid gets a college scholarship, then we want awesome.

Mike Klinzing: [01:08:05] Absolutely. I mean, I think it boils down to us, as you said, as simple as that is, you can be honest with people and you can be genuine.

You’re going to end up building really good relationships and not every single one is going to end up with you being a close personal friend. I mean, I think the podcast speaks to that as well. We’ve had guys on here that we’ve had them on and it’s been great. And then that’s the end of it. We’ve had other guys that we’ve had on that have become good friends.

We’ve got other guys that have come on that have that people that now we considered to be acquaintances that we could call them up, or we could have some kind of dealing with them or we might have them back on the podcast, whatever it may be. So, yeah, I think that there’s all different degrees of relationships, but when you’re genuine and you put it out there and people know that your heart is in the right place and that you’re trying to do the right things and that your mission aligns with their mission, those people, as you said, tend to find each other [01:09:00] brand.

If before we wrap up, I want to give you a chance to share how people can connect with you, social media website, how they can reach out, find out more about what you’re doing. Get involved with you. And then after you do that, I’ll jump back in and wrap things up.

Brandon Goble: [01:09:14] Yeah, for sure. You know, I’m always farting around on Twitter at Juco advocate saying crazy stuff or posting videos or, or whatever.

You know, we, we’ve got at verbal commits as well and www.verbalcommits.com is, is our, our baby and Nathan’s baby. And the thing that he created from nothing and, and now is it’s crazy to me like how big that thing became with just Nathan pounding away on a keyboard. For those that don’t know, every time they see a verbal commits tweet, It’s just Nathan, that does all that.

And Nathan updating the database. And so some of these tech things that we’re rewriting here will, will help Nathan with that hopefully, but so keep an eye on, on verbal commits.com. You know, you’re going to see some exciting stuff coming down the pike here [01:10:00] and yeah, reach out on Twitter.

You know, unfortunately I can’t get to everybody’s DMS. It has kind of gotten to the thing where you get three or 400 of them in a day and, you know, you do the best you can sort of thing, but you know, reach out to us there and just keep an eye on what we got coming down the pike. And we also do the live period podcast.

You can find that on, on apple and Spotify and everything else. Yeah, so

Mike Klinzing: [01:10:22] Awesome, Brandon. Yeah. Cannot thank you enough for taking the time out of your schedule to jump out with us, please make sure that you follow Brandon and make sure you check out the things that he’s doing. I’m personally intrigued by the things that.

He talked about tonight and alluded to that are coming in the future and I’ll be excited to see what those are. I’m sure that you out there and our audience will be excited to see what those are. And Brandon again, thank you for taking the time. We really appreciate it. And to everyone out there, thanks for listening.

And we will catch you on our next episode. Thanks.

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